I'm sure most of you have seen the trailer for the new Solo movie. And with it of course is the onslaught of media that comes with it. And, of course, the inevitable discussions that are already beginning and will surely get worse as the movie approaches, and at their absolute worst after it happens. I have already seen a link to an article that said something like, "Seeing Han and Qi'ra in the Solo movie trailer will change your mind about Han and Leia." Ok, first, how does one trailer with a few brief moments tell us anything about his relationship with the woman? Second, I clicked on said article, and unless I missed something, all it did was recap the trailer in general, stating facts and offering no opinions. So, not sure what that was about except for clickbait. Oh, and third, are we serious here that Leia's first love was named Kier and Han's first love was named Kira - oh, sorry - I mean Qi'ra? Really?
I've been bracing myself for this since this movie was announced. I fully expect there to be a LOT of discussion about Han and this woman from his past, and how they were really meant to be together and she was his true soulmate and it's just too bad that later he had to settle for Leia, because look how that turned out? They will tell us that she knew him better than Leia ever would. And I also fully expect her to die tragically at the end of the movie, because that is just the easiest thing for them to do with her. It's going to be a total rehash of the whole Bria thing, except way worse because social media is WAY far beyond what it was when the old Han Solo trilogy books came out, and a lot more people are watching movies than reading books.
But here is the thing that I want to say. For those of us who have loved Han and Leia from the beginning, and have lot let what has happened in the new movies define them in any way, and have never wavered from feeling like they were just a wonderful couple that we love to follow and read about and write about, don't let this or any other movie change any of that. Don't let anyone try and change your opinion or tell you that this changes anything about the Han and Leia we all grew to love from the original trilogy. I admit that of course I've been one to overreact to a lot of what has been done to these two over the last few years since Disney took over, but I don't want to let it get to me anymore.
A few months after TFA came out, I asked you all what we had to look forward to as Han and Leia fans. Generally, I think most of us who still read here aren't really looking forward to anything in the official canon. They seem to be committed to making it all pretty terrible for our heroes. But the good news is that I've seen some awesome fanfic recently, and it's nice to see that so many Han and Leia fans are still treating them well and giving them the life together that they deserve.
I don't know what my real point in writing this post is. I think mostly it is that I know that a lot of us are going to once again feel kind of hurt and betrayed by whatever might happen in this new movie that will probably make things even worse for Han and Leia somehow, even without Leia being in it at all. There will absolutely also be a loud contingency of people who will be shouting about how Qi'ra is so much better for Han than Leia ever was. What I'm saying is that you don't have to listen to it, or pay attention to it. Or even argue with those people. It's not a contest that we need to win. If there are people who want to ship those two, let them. We don't have to read their stories or agree with them. And hopefully they can respect our different opinion on the subject and not turn it into an all out war over which couple is better. Because, well, it's not like there is a way to "win" that is there?
Just keep reading and writing about the couple you love and don't let any of it get to you. I know it is probably going to get difficult at times, but I think we can handle it!
Thanks, Zyra. I had a wobble a few minutes ago when I started to input tags on a fic chapter and I typed in the pairing (on AO3).
ReplyDeleteIt suddenly struck me that we might soon see Han/Qi'ra paired (in addition to Han/Leia). Ugh. Of course, I don't want that, but then I suppose there are probably Han/Bria and Han/reader and Han/Jessa fics, etc. out there that don't float my boat, either. I'll just stick all the Han/Qi'ra crap in the same pile with the Han/Jabba fics, and forget about it!
Ok, but... who's Jessa? Never mind, I'm sure I don't want to know.
DeleteSee? You're not quite as old as I am! lolol I thought sure you'd remember Jessa, though, from the Brian Daley stories?
DeleteYou know, I never read the Brian Daley Han Solo books. This is very wrong of me, I know. I didn't realize Han also got a former love of his life in those too, lol.
DeleteIIRC, she wasn't "the love of his life" so much as someone he liked and was attracted to, but not attached to at all. It has been a while since I read it, but I think she was of much the same mind...enjoyed the casual relationship while it lasted but didn't seek to extend it beyond its natural life.
DeleteWell, the internet lately seems to be really good at taking minor relationships and turning them into OMG, soulmates! So if these books came out now, I'm sure there would be a lot of that, lol.
DeleteAt least now with the third (right? Or is it more?) version of Han's back story, they have consistently had him as an orphan. So apparently there is one aspect of his past everyone seems to agree with.
I love the Daley books! You should read them. Han is great, and there's no romance. Han might be attracted, but he's no strings. I think The later trilogy (Crispin? The Bria villainess ? references them all.)
DeleteI have zero interest in the movie, really not even worked up. Just don't care. The guy they hired just isn't him. It's probably a cousin, named Solo and Chewie is babysitting.
I'm not worked up over it either, really. But I can see it festering in some people, and can see myself potentially getting caught up later. Although judging by my reaction to TLJ, it can't hurt me anymore.
DeleteOh, brilliant. It's his cousin. Remember how Han has a cousin? Thrackan Sal-Solo who apparently looks just like him? Yes, this can just be him instead.
oh yeah, I like this theory, it's really Han's evil cousin Thracken!
DeleteHoly crap thank you for posting this because I've been waiting for this topic to come up on this blog because I totally need to vent and you are the only people who will understand
ReplyDeleteMuch much more to say on my phone now will type and type and type when I get home
Hey, jz. So good to see you, it's been a while! Rant away, that is what we are here for :)
DeleteThank you for the words of wisdom, Zyra.
ReplyDeleteI choose to look at this movie as just more bad fanfic, or the GFFA version of an ABC After-School Special of Han's life that nobody asked for. We'll get through this...we just need to stick together!
I am totally with you on the bad-but-disney-sanctioned-fanfic thing. that's how I've gotten past TFA and TLJ. just some Disney alternate universe folks. nothing to look at here.
DeleteFirst of all Zyra, A heartfelt thank you for your thoughtful post and for keeping Han and Leia alive through this wonderful space. To say these last two years have been difficult for Han and Leia fans is an understatement. I will see the Solo movie but will not take the relationship between Han and Qi'ra too seriously. In the EW Weekly article, Alden Ehrenreicht says, They grew up together on the tough streets of Corellia, yet Qi'ra is better at negotiating the status quo to survive." so maybe it's more of a brother/sister relationship. Any past relationships would only strengthen Han's future relationship with women. By the time he meets up with Leia, he knows what he wants. Han could have had a lot of women, yet he chose to stay in the Rebellion with Leia and help fight the good fight. He first rescues her on the Death Star, but then she later rescues him and that's when he knows she's the only one.
ReplyDeleteYou're welcome! I'm glad you like it. I keep it alive for precisely this reason, because I want a place to be able to discuss these things, so it's good when other people want the same thing.
DeleteI don't think in the history of movies they haven't set a relationship like that up and not had it get "romantic" in some way, even though they probably SHOULD be more like brother and sister. My guess is they were like that when they were younger and then didn't see each other for a while and then of course saw each other differently when they got older. Doesn't really matter though, as she said herself, she isn't with him in the OT so clearly something happened to make her go away. I admit I'll probably see it too, and I'll try not to put much thought into it. Which shouldn't be hard since that guy looks nothing like Han anyway.
EW already confirmed she was a love interest unfortunately, it says Han falls head over heels for her, but doesn't say when.
DeleteI also think the way they get together is unusual, because I feel like growing up as kids together would make you think of the other person more as your brother/sister, not a romantic partner. Emilia Clarke says at the time the movie starts they've already been together for a while, so my guess is they've grown up together started dating as teenagers and then split due to circumstances at 18, then get back together at 24 and in the meantime both of them have changed a lot but they still try to make it work romantically (similar to Bria and Han, it seems they're borrowing everything bad from Legends).
My impression from what has been said about her is that she's not a good person and ends up betraying him and breaking his heart, which is why he's so cynical and bitter in ANH (again shades of Bria!) But he meets Leia, who's just such a good and kind and compassionate woman and is blown away by how GOOD she is because he's never met anyone like that before, and he's able to fall in love again.
The director said that Han and Qi'Ra were inspired by Pip/Estella, and I don't know if everyone here has read Great Expectations, but Estella does NOT treat Pip very well and breaks his heart numerous times (they grew up together as children as well).
I'd never read that (I'm sure I should have) so thanks for letting us know about that. I do like that theory that Han had never met anyone as GOOD as Leia who keeps her word and wouldn't hurt him. Let's go with that.
DeleteOk, so. First off, I've spent the entire last week being asked how excited I am about the SOlo movie and my standard, honest answer has been, "there was nothing in the trailer that I had any emotion about at all. zero. zip. nada." people usually look at me oddly because they "know" I "am into" Star Wars and think I must love this glut of new movies. meh. and this trailer was so... dull. nothing made me react, at all. if it weren't for the brief glimpse of star destroyers and chewie there would be nothing to even make me think it is supposed to be Star Wars. it's just... some movie. no goosebumps. no tears. just... nothing.
ReplyDeleteI have been reading a lot of fan fiction lately, including my own, trying to get back in the right frame of mind to write again. I filter out anything with Kylo and anything with Han or Leia paired with anyone else. and all the Mary Sues. I don't have to read what makes me angry.
and I'm enjoying the fact that Star Wars is mainstream again.
my daughter says she will find me the Solo movie on a sketchy site so I don't have to pay for it. and we can laugh at it together.
my son loves it all and is happy for no mushiness. he will love the Solo movie if my daughter is right and it's the JJ conception of Han the bad boy.
It took me over a month to see TLJ, at first because of dread, but then because of apathy. I just couldn't scrape up enough curiosity or interest in it to make me change out of my pyjamas and leave the house over the Christmas break (ha!), and especially knowing the basic plot and character *cough* "developments".
DeleteAnd now, with the Solo film, I find myself once again in that slightly surreal place where I simply don't care very much about a new Star Wars movie, which is just so weird. I imagine I will eventually see it, but probably c. 6 months after release, when my brother-in-law will undoubtedly put it on his Plex server and I can watch it without paying for it.
I don't dread it like I did TLJ, though. Really, my biggest qualm is for the poor sap who signed up to step into Harrison Ford's shoes. I feel secondhand embarrassment for him already (even though I have no idea whether he'll do a good job or not). I think he could do an outstanding job and still suffer for it, professionally, because they are mighty big shoes to fill.
Like you, jz, I am enjoying SW being mainstream again, even if it does mean having to sift through unwanted images, etc. I'm glad to see they've revived a lot of the "classic" merchandise (along with all the new Disney stuff), and I am happy to cherrypick the stuff I like, and leave the rest. I find it interesting and gratifying that there are so many Kylo Rens left sitting on the shelves, though, when all the cute Chewie and R2-D2 and BB-8 stuff regularly sells out.
A reader with whom I regularly correspond told me about a company called Loungefly that produces some pretty amazing SW merch. I'm probably just dozy and oblivious, though, and you guys already know all about it!
I've got my eye on that Leia purse/wallet at $38. If you click through and look at all the images of it, you'll see the cute Han/Leia kissy-face icons on the interior. I've had the same wallet since c. 2003 and it's just about worn out. I totally deserve a new one, right?
DeleteIsn't it odd to be NOT excited for a Star Wars movie? It's almost unsettling. And it also scares me how quickly it happened. When we were getting TFA trailers and stuff I got chills every time, and probably 90% of the time I had actual tears in my eyes. Now? Nothing. I wonder how it is for a lot of other people too. I have my official Star Wars crew who I go see all the movies with. The other members of our little crew are all boys, so their perspective may be slightly different, but we have gone to see all the movies together since we were old enough to see them, which means everything since Episode I. Normally we are talking to each other about all of this, but nobody has said a word about Solo. That seems telling to me. And reminds me of after we all saw TPM and were all really, really quiet because we were all kind of afraid to vocalize the fact that we were really disappointed after all that build up. My point is, I don't think we're the only ones who aren't excited.
DeleteI love to hear someone else admit they re-read their own fanfic, because I totally do that too, lol. I'm CURIOUS to see how they are planning on portraying Han, definitely a little nervous that they will go pretty deep on the "doesn't care about anyone" side of things, but at the same time, I think I'm beyond the point where they can make me angry about it, because I just expect that kind of stuff from these people now.
Erin, I feel the same way about this new Han. And it's not because it's this particular guy, I'd have felt bad for anyone stepping into that role. I think they are impossible shoes to fill, and a LOT of people agree with that. Not only is this a story we don't need/want told, but there is just no other human who has ever existed who could possibly take that on and do a good job with it. I've read people joking about how they would find it more acceptable to have present-day Harrison Ford playing his younger self and not even attempt to make him look younger and that would still be the most believable portrayal, and I totally agree with that. I'll probably go see it the first weekend, because it has become the tradition with my crew. I don't think I'll be dreading it though, and popcorn is always good. Maybe I can at least enjoy Chewbacca.
Oh, Star Wars merchandise. It has been fun to see more of it. I did see something last night on the news about how merchandise sales are way below expected. Which kind of made me laugh. They are blaming the fact that kids are asking for toys less now and mostly using devices instead. But I think part of it too is that these new movies are NOT for kids. They really aren't, and that's pretty sad. We don't need PG-13 Star Wars movies, they should dial it back for younger audiences like the old ones. But then that would require lightening them up, which clearly they are not interested in.
I was totally unaware of that site, Erin. Thanks for the link, some really cool stuff there!
Soooo.... Erin, did you get the wallet???? ;)
DeleteSadly, no, I have not gotten the wallet yet. I'm a miserable git. :D
DeleteFirst, a big thank you to Zyra for creating this place for Han/Leia fans. I've been looking for a place to vent about the Solo movie and all the regular Han/Leia haunts seem to be dead until I found this place.
ReplyDeleteLike many of you I've been skeptical about this movie since it was announced. Alden doesn't really look or sound anything like Han, although I can't say he did a bad job in the trailer I saw. I think if I see it I'll just have to focus my attention on whether he captures Han rather than what he looks like. Donald Glover as Lando looks great though.
For those worried about Han/Qi'ra overshadowing Han/Leia, I suggest you read Emilia Clarke's interview on the matter: http://ew.com/movies/2018/02/08/emilia-clarke-solo-a-star-wars-story/ because it doesn't sound at all like they are building them up to be soulmates or anything like that. Emilia says in the interview her character does something (presumably) terrible to Han to make him the cynical loner he is in ANH. She also doesn't make it sound like Qi'Ra is a good person, more of an anti-hero/femme fatale. It sounds like they were childhood friends who grew up together as kids, fell in love as teenagers, went their separate ways for a while and then got back together as adults when Beckett is putting together a team for a heist. Judging from what Emilia said in the interview, my guess is she betrays him and then dies (and yes I want her to die to avoid her being brought back in an EU book in the future to cause problems between Han and Leia).
How did the Falcon go from being so new to looking so crappy in ANH? Does Han have a meth habit?
Oh and I also read the "Han and Qi'ra romance will make you forget about Han and Leia!" The movie isn't even out yet, so how do people know that? I saw another article about how Han and Qi'Ra will be way better than Han and Leia because Han and Leia as seen from TFA were unhealthy and dysfunctional and Han acted like a jerk to Leia in most of their interactions, but how does that journalist (I use "journalist" in quotes) know that Hand and Qi'Ra are going to be so much better when the movie hasn't come out yet?
On shipper wars, I think if you stay within your own place like this blog you'll be fine. It's more places on Tumblr and FF.N where there's probably going to be huge shipping wars, because no one ever stays within their own lane at those places. I'm glad to have a safe space like this!
Hey, Suzanne, welcome and so glad you like it here! I can say I thought he did a bad job in the trailer, lol. But I will also say that I was never one who thought that the most important thing was looking like Harrison or trying to do a good impersonation of him, because first, nobody looks like that. Unfortunately. Second, there is just a lot more to it than simply resembling the character required to truly carry a movie.
DeleteI think for myself, and probably others, I'm not as much concerned that the MOVIE will tell us that Han and Qi'ra (that is an annoying name to type. Thanks, Disney!)were a better couple, but that a contingency of online people will. Sort of like how people are twisting around this whole thing about Han and Leia being terrible parents or whatever and that is why Kylo turned, even though as of now there is actually zero evidence in any new movies or books that suggest that was the reason. People are good at twisting things around. Oh and also twisting around how Han and Leia were wrong for each other or had a terrible relationship, even though at least as far as I've heard based on Bloodline, they were happy for at least 25 years before Han left due to unspeakable tragedy, NOT because of their failing relationship. But anyway...
Lol to Han's meth habit. He sure did dirty that ship up in short order, didn't he?
You are correct that "journalist" is a word that must be put in quotes more often than not. So-called articles are just about getting clicks and not about actual content. Most fanfic I've read also has better grammar. It's pretty terrible.
And yes, my strategy is to stay out of any sort of shipper wars because really, what is even the point? I don't need to convince someone that Han and Leia are better in order for me to enjoy them. I've learned some things since I was a kid during the whole Bria fiasco.
Oh I so agree that having a Harrison imitation would be worse. I'm just going to try to go in with an open mind, so far one thing I feel Disney has done well is casting (although still not over them picking Emilia Clarke over Tessa Thompson), so I'm trying to have faith they picked the right guy.
DeleteThe press really DOES seem to love to trash Han/Leia don't they? When Bloodline came out and revealed they had actually been married for 25 years or so, there were no articles about it but when one book came out that had them argue over fruit, there were a million articles that is argument over fruit somehow explained why they got divorced (even though they didn't divorce) 25 years later. I fully expect a ton of "Han and Qi'Ra love story is 10 times the story Han and Leia's is" articles in the obsession with "outdoing" everything that has come before, and there also seems to be this new trend of seeing Han and Leia's dynamic in ESB as unhealthy and that TFA was the inevitable conclusion of a dysfunctional relationship, even though we have canon evidence of a good relationship for 25 years. Whatever, I don't get it. I also fully expect that there's going to be a ton of articles that Qi'Ra "Explains" why Han and Leia broke up later on, because obviously she was the REAL love of Han's life and Han never really loved Leia, so of course that's why they broke up.
I definitely feel like Emilia Clarke (and I don't want to hate her for who she's playing) doesn't consider herself to be playing the love of Han's life or anything like that, she says in the interview she leaves a shadow on Han (which means she probably does something very bad to him) and at the end of the interview she mentions that he ends up with Leia so it all turns out good. She even says that she's not in the OT and Han never mentions her, so something must have happened to make her go away.
I have to say I don't really love that they grew up together as children and have known each other all their lives, because that means she gets like 20 years with Han while Leia got only about that same amount? It's also a common trope used in so many "soulmate" movies - them growing up together as children. Maybe that makes me petty :) I'll also be irrationally jealous if they get scenes of them doing intense long make outs or in bed together, stuff we didn't get with Han and Leia in the OT, and I fully expect those to be in there, because Han is the main character in this movie unlike the OT so there's more time for that kind of stuff. I know it's irrational but that's how I'll feel I know!
On shipping wars - I feel like us Han/Leia fans have been spoiled on that front and now it's time for a rude awakening. They've been paired only with each other for 40 years, and we've never really had to compete with another pairing. I was thinking of joining Tumblr the other day, but when I searched Han/Leia all I found was a bunch of Han Solo movie gifs and Han/Qi'ra shipping sites. People are shipping them already and the movie hasn't even come out yet? I can't figure out how to navigate that site but it makes me sad that normally I would have joined, but now I'm just not going to bother because I don't want to have to deal with shipping wars. You're right that there's no point in trying to change anyone's mind, and there really isn't any "right" or "wrong" way. If someone wants to believe Qi'Ra was Han's soulmate and he never loved again, we're not going to convince them otherwise, it's best that we just leave them in peace. I just hope they leave us alone too.
DeleteI will say though that Qi'Ra's costumes and make up are stunning. In fact if it doesn't get me kicked off the Han/Leia team I might even cosplay as her at some point. I do like that she seems completely different than Leia (almost her polar opposite) and is someone who's not completely good or evil. I think I could get to like her character if I keep an open mind.
Oh, you've come to the right place if you want petty jealousy and irrational annoyances, we're good at that here ;) I'm glad someone can go in with an open mind, I certainly can't.
DeleteYep, they totally love to bash Han and Leia. I mean, remember not too long ago when there was a pre-ESB comic book where Han's "wife" showed up? Sana Solo? There were dozens of articles out there about Han's wife, and how this meant that for Han to be with Leia he had to be cheating on his wife, and all sorts of crazy stories. Admittedly we freaked out over here too because the articles blew it all out of proportion, because of course just one or two comic book issues later the truth was revealed that this wedding was all a ruse and of course those two had never been married. But just like you said, there were no articles to clarify that either.
Oh, I do agree that Disney has done well with casting, I just wish they gave them all a better story to be a part of. Daisy, John and Oscar are great, but what they have been given to DO just makes me sad!
I think it was an odd thing to say that Han never mentions her in the OT. I mean... why would he? It's not like there was time spent on getting to know you conversations. It's not like we hear Leia mentioning her parents, or Luke talking about Owen or Beru or any of his friends on Tatooine we know he had. So, that I don't think says anything either way about how their relationship had to have ended, whether on good or bad terms.
I hadn't really thought about that, that this woman maybe knew Han longer than Leia got to, but yes now that makes me mad too, lol. Also knowing someone from childhood just gives you this deep connection that can't really be replicated, which is also annoying. I guess I could be sort of concerned about them getting more like, romantic scenes together but for some reason I'm not overly worried about that. This is still Star Wars, and romance has never been high on the list, so I don't think there will be a lot of that. I hope.
Ah, missed your mention of shipping wars. I and I think probably a lot of us here might be too young, but there WERE shipping wars with people who wanted Leia and Luke to wind up together vs. people who wanted her with Han. This was before anyone knew they were related. And there was certainly some wars over Bria back when the Han Solo trilogy came out.
DeleteI don't get at all people going crazy over a relationship we know nothing about yet. I really don't. But then there are a lot of things on the internet that don't make sense to me that people seem to be really into. Her costumes are very cool because we haven't gotten to see much variety in terms of what women in the Star Wars universe wear. I mean we've got Padme's elaborate queen attire, but then also her more practical battle outfits. Leia was mostly dressed for battle as well, or overwhelmingly simply. And Rey so far has worn what, 2 different outfits that were mostly rags? So I guess it will definitely be interesting to see some more varied clothes. Because I don't know about anyone else, but when trying to imagine these people in different scenarios for my writing, I often have a very hard time coming up with what they might be wearing in that universe.
Oh I am so glad this place is non judgmental of petty jealousy and irrational annoyances. I KNOW in my head it sounds crazy to be worked up about this, I mean I ask myself would I care if my husband had a previous girlfriend where they broke up years before he even met me, and of course not! But then would I want to watch an entire film about them falling in love with each other, no I wouldn't! That's kind of how I feel about this. I read a post somewhere else that said that the last time we see Han kiss someone on screen, it'll be with Qi'Ra, not Leia, and got irrationally annoyed all over again. I know that chronologically speaking the last person you see him kiss is Leia, but they're right this will be the most recent filmed one! It also made me annoyed all over again they didn't let them kiss in TFA.
DeleteI remember the whole insanity over the wife scandal, and you're right it turned out to be a big fat nothing, but that didn't stop the media from going crazy. It's funny that that was considered sacrilege to the Han/Leia romance but it's going to be so minor compared to what happens in this new movie. Another thing we should remember is that most of the mainstream media outlets are tied to major companies and are hired to promote movies, so an article about "Wow - Han and Qi'Ra's romance is a zillion times better than Han and Leia's!" is going to get more people interested in the Solo movie than an article about how their romance was terrible and a pale imitation of Han/Leia.
You're right that Han wouldn't have mentioned her in the OT anyway, even if she had died tragically right before ANH starts or something. But definitely from the rest of the interview with Emilia talking about how you can't quite put your finger on what she really is, that the movie is about who to trust and whose side you're really on, that she's a ruthless survivor and how if she's done her job as an actress you'll see the effect she's had on Han's character all made me think that she is going to do something terrible to Han that makes him the cynical loner we see in ANH.
You're right about childhood bonds being special, but falling in love for the only person you've known since childhood also is in line with being young and stupid and thinking they're the only ones when you've never known any better? I think we will see Han's eyes become wide open when he realizes that she never really loved him and completely used him (at least I hope so!)
I didn't realize there were shipping wars over Bria. That seems crazy to me, because to me her character in the book seems really similar to what they're hinting Qi'Ra to be, someone completely wrong for Han who stabs him in the back. I can't believe anyone would ship them together, but then people ship crazy things on the Internet so I can't be surprised any more. I predict a lot of shippers of Han/Qi'Ra after the movie comes out but I would guess most of them after a few years would move onto other things. Han/Leia fans are a patient bunch, we can just wait out the storm if we need to lol.
Lando and Qi'Ra's outfits are some of the few things I'm looking forward to seeing (that and some of the locations look really neat, and I think seeing the underworld in SW will be interesting). I do at least appreciate, as much as I'm not thrilled with having to watch it, that they've made his love interest so completely unlike Leia with growing up as a street rat and then rising high in the world of organized crime. That should hopefully avoid any "He fell in love with Leia because she reminded him of Qi'ra takes" (who am I kidding? They're going to write that anyway, by virtue of them both being short brunettes).
DeleteMinor quibbles, but I always thought the Falcon was an OLD ship when Han got her and that's part of the reason he loves her so much. I read the Millennium Falcon a few years ago and that's still my head canon that she's over a hundred years old by the time we see her in ANH, not just a few years old.
I don't know that the Falcon is necessarily going to be all that new when Han gets it, just that Lando likes things a certain way. I agree though I'll be disappointed if they decide the Falcon was kind of new when he got it. I think it speaks to Han's loyalty that he doesn't want to get rid of a beat up old ship.
DeleteI wasn't planning on seeing this at all and certainly, the trailers haven't made me change my mind.
ReplyDeleteI am fully expecting to see articles like "Ehrenreich & Glover are the Han and Lando We Need Now/Better than Ford and Williams" - certainly the first iteration. I feel sort of sorry for Ehrenreich (Glover is already loved even tho Lando would not be caught DEAD in that coat!) but he took the part....
I am already cackling at the whole "oh, Harrison told us this and that and liked the script" - sure Jan. Today it was "George came by and gave us ideas" - sure he did. I think it's hysterically funny how they don't mention George unless they want to quell opinions....
And you have to go read this one, it's a modern classic!
http://www.vulture.com/2018/02/why-do-star-wars-fans-want-the-new-han-solo-movie-to-flop.html
Yes, we will see articles like that. And it's like... WHY do we even need to be talking about something like that? Donald Glover was actually the one announcement about this that I thought was a genuinely good idea at the time I heard it. And a Lando spinoff movie is something I might actually not mind, since his character has barely been explored at all, and recently has been completely forgotten entirely.
DeleteCan I just say that I love that "Sure, Jan," is becoming a thing? Lol. Anyway, yeah, Harrison was gracious enough to have one lunch with the kid, good for him. I also enjoyed the article about how George "directed" part of the movie, because he was on set one day and suggested one thing. Ok, fine.
Ah, good article. And yes, it addresses so many things about the problems I have with it, and really all of it. They keep talking about "moving on" while simultaneously going back to old characters. The thing about moving on is that it could've easily been accomplished by jumping to an entirely different time period and not moving on at the expense of already established characters. Or shoehorning other people into old plot points like they did with Rogue One. You can't keep talking about moving on while simultaneously not at all moving on!
This article brings up an interesting thing though that I hadn't even thought of, which is the prequels. It's funny, but with all that has happened in the Star Wars fandom recently, I barely remember the prequels existed or their problems. And really, my problems with the prequels had little to do with the actual story. The basic outline of the story is actually good. Some of the execution could've been... well, way better. And a few small things I'd have liked to have seen changed, but overall, I can't argue that much with the story.
But come on, people, stop talking about moving forward and stuff while not at all moving forward. At least they won't be making the same mistake with these last movies by having different people try to write a coherent trilogy without actually consulting each other about the overall story arc, because that is completely ridiculous.
Eh... I don't really care what they do at this point. I don't think there's any way I could love this movie, but I'm pretty indifferent, aside from thinking that Alden as Han leaves me a little repulsed. I mean, who cares if he really looks or sounds like Harrison, but could they have at least given us someone good-looking with sex appeal? Young Harrison Ford was so pretty! Such high quality eye-candy. I'm afraid I'm immediately less interested in faux Solo because he just does not look like a sexy Scoundrel. And he's too short. And looks too old for twenty. Harrison just has this very low-key confident physical presence. Call it charisma, sex appeal, star quality, whatever. Alden does not have it. Poor guy. He's always going to be a designer knock-off for me!
ReplyDeleteAgree. Alden is surely fine on his own... but trying to be Harrison Fo-- I mean, Han Solo? Just doesn't quite work. The comparisons are inevitable, and there will only ever be the original.
DeleteGiven that the same screenwriter (Kasdan) that is responsible for TFA wrote Solo... I'm gonna pass. I liked Alden in 'Hail, Caesar', tho. He was quite good in that.
ReplyDeleteWhat's interesting is how different the new canon comics (OT era) are from the movies. Han and Leia are just like what we would think they would be. Poe (he has is own comic series) is fantastic -- not at all what TLJ, which I refuse to see, portrays him as. He's a badass, but respected by all.
There is a serious disconnect somewhere.
--MrsScruffyNerfherder
A lot of great thoughts here. So glad there is a place to discuss this! I am very much looking forward to this movie. Han is my favorite character and I'm hoping they do him justice. Before I get into my thoughts on Han/Qi'ra I want to say that I think I'll enjoy EH's portrayal of Han. But he won't be the same Han that I was so attracted to in ANH and ESB. I think he will be a fun character. He'll be Han in so many ways, but I doubt I'll be dreaming about him at night. LOL.
ReplyDeleteAs far as Han and Qi'Ra go, I am not too worried. I feel like this whole relationship stuff will be overblown and the movie will focus on the business/survival side of their relationship. If anything, the romance will set up Han for meeting Leia, who is the love of his life. Pretty sure Qi'Ra will betray/hurt Han. Kasdan knows Han very well and I see him respecting the OT Han and his relationship with Leia. I'm not letting the stuff that happens after Ben goes dark destroy my vision of H/L. It was just a lazy plot device. We'll never convince the haters otherwise. There will definitely be some annoying H/Q fic out there but I'll just ignore it and read all the awesome H/L fanfic. As some others have mentioned, I've also be reading a ton more as of late. One final thought I have is that everyone seems to be in love with Donald Glover and his portrayal of Lando. He's just so cool. I get it. Maybe the shippers will push poor little Han out of the way and write a ton of Qi'Ra and Lando fanfic! A girl can hope. With all this being said, I think she'll be a neat character. I simply am not too worried.
Thanks Zyra for not giving up hope and this blog! If you ever get so depressed or anything that makes you want to quit - don't delete anything! Leave it here for us.
ReplyDeleteI'm worried about that Han Solo movie but now that I read your comments, I think I could manage not to care what it has to give. I really consider if I should see it at all before coming here and read your critics. Then I at least know what to prepare myself for. I have NEVER considered NOT seeing a new Star Wars movie and even with PT I was always excited to see the new ones! Even after TFA I was thrilled to see TLJ, maybe because Han was dead, I thought they can't hurt their relation ship anymore. So I could not wait to see Leia and the hero Luke and who's daughter is Rey - and what we got? Mary Poppins and a crumpy old d**k and an orphan of nobodies because someone thinks there's too much about Skywalkers in this Skywalker based Saga.
When Disney bought Star Wars, I really was optimistic. I have always loved Disney movies and how true love solves everything and all will be fine. I was sure that now Han and Leia will have their moments. Or some comfortable love in the air if not really any moments. Nope.
I use Pinterest a lot because I love to crochet etc. Pinterest is an endless place for ideas but also fan art and other pictures. So of course I have been searching Star Wars stuff, too. I have been super annoyed for all the Reylo stuff I don't seem to be able to filter out from my "news feed". And now there will be Han and Qi'ra stuff! NOOOOOOOO!
I'm hoping that they show some respect to the OT and won't make us see Han and Leia in a bad light. Well, ok, it can be different from the ST but not OT. Maybe Qi'ra lacks some features Leia has, something what Han is missing before he finds Leia?
I couldn't believe there was barely nothing about Han's death in TLJ all though there was so little time passed. Days maybe? Maybe Leia will be buried next to Han...
Oh my god. You do not know how relieved i feel to see that there are those who share these thoughts with me. When the trailer first came out, i couldn't describe what i was feeling, but i think i could relate to your saying of feeling hurt and betrayed. I dont want a movie portrayal of Han with another love interest! :( particularly because of what you pointed out about shippers or fanfics popping up about them, and undermining the relationship of Han and Leia.
ReplyDeleteI am not very confident about the movie .I mean, Han was Harrison Ford, and another guy playing him is just not the same.
With the Kira situation---My God was I scared when i first saw her on that trailer, as silly as it may seem considering she was there for only a few seconds. HOWEVER, this is me being hopeful: We do not know anything about the girl's character. I try searching for her and all that comes up is what the trailer has shown, which isn't much. Yes, i have read that she may be a possible love interest for Han Solo, but so far, no one that has said that has shown any other source or theory other than the age old cliche that every female in a movie that is with the male character has to be his love interest.
When Emilia Clarke (playing Qira) was asked about the role, she said it was going to be "awesome". Now, this actress is the same girl who plays Daenerys Targaryen, one of the most considered badass female characters om TV, particularly for the feministic theme that surrounds her character. She also played that Terminator chick, idk i havent watched it but she was supposedly a "badass" female character there too. Given that track record, i'm hoping that her definition of an "awesome" female character sticks.
Another thing: this is the first Solo movie, right? They are giving background to a character which embodies cynicism, bravado, mercenary, smugness, cockiness, bitterness, etc, but not so later on had or started towards his redemption. This new movie's goal is to give background to that, show the rough life that he had where he learned or was practicing those qualities before he eventually settled on redemption and goodness. What i'm hoping for is, that the directors somehow realize the futility of incorporating a cliche romance on this background movie, in order to fully get across the theme. Even if they do imply romance or any kind of relationship, i HOPE that it showcases the commitment-phobic Han other than his unlikely and unbreakable bond with Chewie, because what sense would it be for this movie to present a theme of a young Han Solo making commitments/ getting into serious relationships? The movie is supposed to finish off with the feeling of an adventure starting, which is why i see no place for any romantic attachments, even if they would exist in the movie, to last until the end.
Anyway, these might be all just wishful thinking, but i still hope that it is not. Thank you for posting this
Unfortunately, EW confirmed that Qi’ra is Han’s love interest. It says Han falls head over heels for her and Emilia Clarke says Qi’ra and Han grew up on the streets together as kids and their relationship later turned romantic. More about Qi’ra here:?http://ew.com/movies/2018/02/08/emilia-clarke-solo-a-star-wars-story/
DeleteFrom what’s been revealed, it sounds like they grew up together as kids, fell in love as teenagers and started a Bonnie and Clyde like partnership as partners in crime on the streets, were separated for several years while she rose high up in the ranks of the criminal underworld, then get back together and then she dies/betrays him and then dies.
I think they’re going for the cliche “Han’s cynical and bitter because a woman he loved hurt him”. The director compared her and Han’s relationship to Pip and Estella, so I think it’s going to be Han idealizing and worshipping her while being blindly in love which she takes advantage of to manipulate and betray him and then tragically die. That’s my guess anyway. But shes definitely a love interest and it isn’t some casual fling (unfortunately).
I guess maybe the only potential good news of this is that now we won't have a Han who is sleeping with like, dozens of different women over the course of a few months? So there's that? Doesn't leave much room for him to be a womanizer, does it? Although who knows how old he is when it ends, if he's only supposed to be like 23 and he doesn't meet Leia until he's 29 that leaves a lot of space for quite a bit of sleeping around (and a pretty big growth spurt).
DeleteI don't really like this, either. The idea that it sounds like maybe he is with this woman for many many years. I actually liked the way the HST did a few things, and one of them was having Han in a few fairly committed relationships that would last at least several months at a time, but nothing that got incredibly deep. (It was not until I re-read the books recently that I realized how unbelievably short his relationship with Bria actually was, which only makes even less sense as to how much it affected him.)
I still have a bad feeling they will stick some things in that will undermine what he has later with Leia. And it's like what someone stated above, thinking about their husband and prior relationships. I mean, unless you're both still like 16 I think most of us are ok with someone having prior relationships. We even expect it. But there is a difference between knowing about it in the general sense, and seeing every painful detail put up and brought to the forefront. And THAT is something nobody needs or wants to see.
While I also don't like that they have been the only person in each other's lives since they were kids, I still think *story wise* it will not be as bad as Bria. Because in this version, it looks like Han is in love with her from about 13-24 (when the movie ends and she presumably betrays him and dies), and then he has five years to get over her by the time ANH rolls around. In the Bria version, even though he's only with her a very short period of time, Han was in love with her from 19-29 (much more formative adult years) and could never get over her, and then only about 5 minutes before ANH starts does he get any kind of closure on their relationship, which makes him meeting Leia less than a day later seem VERY fast. I think we're also supposed to believe that he's still not over Bria between ANH and ESB to explain why Han doesn't pursue Leia earlier. In this version it looks I think she will be used to explain why Han is cynical and distrustful (again cliche, it's always because of a woman) but not treat his portrayal in ANH as someone completely heartbroken and grieving for his lost love.
DeleteUnless they do something horrible like put an "I love you" "I know" between them as someone else suggested in another thread. That would be one of the absolute worst things they could do!
I still think she's going to do something pretty bad to Han. Emilia describes her as a femme fatale which is characterized as a beautiful woman who uses her feminine charms and seduction skills to seduce and manipulate men into doing their bidding for their own selfish gain. I think she's going to reach out to Han to get him involved in the heist, taking advantage of the fact he's still in love with her, pretend to get back together with him romantically while still planning to betray him, and then at the end of the heist, stab him in the back and take all the money for herself, or turn him and his friends to a bounty hunter for a heft payout.
"A pretty big growth spurt" nearly made me spit out my drink, Zyra! lolol. After my coughing fit, though, I have to say that the new actor's height bugs me a little. Not because I've got anything against short people, but because Han's long-legged gunslinger silhouette seems intrinsic to his character. I doubt very much the character was written with a physical type in mind but HF just owned it, and I can't see the new guy pulling it off very well. The other thing that makes me skeptical about the casting is AE's voice. I've only watched one clip on YouTube of him in an interview, but that was enough. It's just not 'Han Solo', to me, not by a long mile. But to be honest, I don't think there's anyone in Hollywood who could fill those shoes. That poor kid had a really tough gig, taking on that role; I hope for his sake he acquits himself well and goes on to do bigger and better things.
DeleteI'm far more worried, though, about the script borrowing dialogue from Han and Leia's interactions and giving them to the new character. If Han says, "I love you" and Qi'Ra replies, "I know", I'm going to glug down a bottle of wine and then hit myself over the head with it, I swear.
Okay, I'm being melodramatic and silly. I'm not even going to see the damn thing, so I don't know what I'm fretting about! Y'all will just have to tell me if Qi'Ra is the one who gives Han his chin scar.... *barf*
His height, and just general presence, are part of the character. In the same way it would be weird if they cast a young Leia and she was 5'10", or a tall young Luke. It just doesn't make sense.
DeleteAnd yes, totally, I'm so concerned that they are going to steal things from Han and Leia later on and stick them into this. Why can't they just let the two relationships be totally separate and have nothing to do with each other? No faint reminders for Han later? Is that too much to ask?
I'll tell you all about it once I see it. Luckily we have a few more months to not deal with this. Someone already trolled ff.net with a story labeled for Han and Leia that is about Qi'ra so people are not wasting any time.
OH GAWD I had to look. Call it morbid curiosity.
DeleteThe author's pen name, even...pass the eye bleach, please, and pour me a nice tall glass while you're at it.
I just can't with this movie. You're a trooper, Zyra, for planning on seeing it opening day. The only way I'll go and see it is if you tell me it's worthy of a viewing, otherwise...nopenopenope.
The only good news is that of course I saw the user name and knew it was probably going to be a troll before opening, and I only skimmed to confirm that yep, Leia isn't even in the story. Whatever.
DeleteAnd thanks, not sure yet if it will be opening day or not. It will depend on what my Star Wars movie posse decides. Although since they all seem to drop everything when a new one comes out, there is definitely a solid chance that yes, we will be seeing it opening day. Although that has been easier lately with all these December release dates, not as much going on. Memorial Day could be trickier. Time will tell. There are a lot of other movies being released in the coming months that I am far more excited about.
I think I’m going to stay away from ffn and A03 after the movie comes out. Because people will not label properly and label fics like Han leaving Leia for Qi’ra, AUs where Han and Qi’ra end up together and fics of Han cheating on Leia with Qi’ra as Han/Leia and there is no way to tell what is safe.
DeleteAlso just heard there are going to be TWO books on Qi’ra coming out (one before the movie and one after), so it sounds like LFL is really pushing for her to be the next Leia. My bet is the first one is about her teenage years growing up with Han and the next is either the years spent in the time apart from Han or (worse) what happens to her after she survives the Solo movie. But I don’t think that’s likely, I think she’s almost for sure going to die.
Well, I guess one plus side to this Disney takeover thing is that it sure has saved me money on Star Wars books. I did buy the novelization of TFA, because I had some weird hopes still that maybe there might be something good added in there that wasn't in the movie. We all know that there was not. Someone borrowed it and didn't give it back, and I hope they never do.
DeleteAdmittedly I HAVE been buying the collections of the new Marvel comics, because it all takes place before ESB, so we can just pretend that is in an entirely different timeline, and there is actually some good stuff in there.
I've been trying not to get too worked up about Han/Qi'ra, because of course everyone is allowed to have previous relationships, and Leia is a child and Han doesn't even know she exists in this movie. I mean in Smalleville, I liked Clarke and Lana Lang's relationship, even though you knew they weren't going to end up together because his end game is Lois Lane, and I didn't feel like Clark falling for Lana Lang as a teenager undermines anything he has with Lois later on. But like you guys, given their track record and Kasdan's dislike of Han/Leia, what I'm worried about is some retroactive justification no one needed that THIS is actually the reason why they drifted apart later because she was actually the love of his life, not Leia, or as I've seen some people say, that he and Qi'ra had a lot in common (both being Corellian, growing up together, smugglers in the criminal underworld) while he and Leia didn't so it was easier for them to drift apart. JJ/Kasdan were already pushing that line that Han and Leia are incompatible because they're too different in TFA.
DeleteI'm also sure there's going to be a gazillion articles about how Han and Qi'ra are so much better than Han and Leia, or how Qi'ra explains why Han and Leia broke up later, or that Han fell for Leia because she reminded him of Qi'ra, even if there is nothing actually in the movie to support that, because that seems to be what the press likes to do with Han/Leia for some reason, like how there were 200 articles out that a book predicted why they got divorced later on because an excerpt in a book that had Leia pregnant and Han kind of bored because he doesn't have a job, even though in that canon they don't separate for like over 20 years later.
Shipping wars are annoying but hopefully the Han/Qi'ra fans will leave us alone. I already noticed some of them popping up on Tumblr in the Han Solo tag (mostly seem to be Emilia Clarke/GOT fans) but they don't seem to be cross tagging with HanLeia at least (for now). I didn't mind Leia being paired with Kier pre ANH because I knew that no one was going to start a shipping war over a book maybe a few thousand people read, but millions of people are going to see this movie (and it may be the first time they're introduced to the character of Han Solo) and I fully expect there will be a LOT of fans who will consider them soulmates after this movie comes out and want to argue with Han/Leia fans.
Also if Han says "I love you" and Qi'ra says "I know" that would really be the final nail in the coffin of crapping all over Han and Leia. I've seen a lot of speculation that will happen, but even though I don't think they give a crap about ruining Han/Leia (they've already done that), I think they would consider that unoriginal and not go there. At least I hope so.
Okay, on the more optimistic front:
DeleteI agree with others that based on Emilia's interview, unless she's deliberately trying to throw things off, that it seems like Qi'ra is going to betray Han. I am sure she is still going to die tragically, and I think it's very possible she redeems herself by sacrificing herself in some heroic way, but I do think based on the description of her as a femme fatale that she's going to do betray Han for her own gain that will explain his trust issues in ANH.
I like that she is from what we've seen very different from Leia, growing up on the streets, from a poor upbringing, and then moving up in the criminal underworld. One of my major problems with Bria is her being way too superficially similar to Leia in being a rich girl who becomes a Rebellion martyr and getting way too involved in OT events. I think it'll be hard to make an argument that Han falls for Leia because she reminds him of Qi'ra based on how different they seem (although I'm sure people will still make this argument). Also, we've never seen a femme fatale in SW before so that's kind of interesting on its own (whether Emilia can pull that off acting wise is another story...)
Oh and I did like that Emilia even notes in her interview that Han and Leia are end game. I wonder if she knows her character is automatically going to get blow back by virtue of not being Leia and is trying to soften the blow.
Oops! Looks like i have spoken too soon with my 3rd paragraph. Looks like there was already a released statement of Emilia about having romantic edge to her relationship with Han. But honestly, with the way Emilia talked about it, i am *less* worried than i was when there was no description to their relationship.
ReplyDeleteHere is her statement:
"They grew up as pals, as partners in crime," she told EW. "There is obviously the romantic side of things. But they grew up together. So they were kids together... Qi’ra is one of those relationships that has an impact on him as a character. I mean, hopefully [laughs] — if I have done my job. And within that relationship, the thing that that you see with Qi’ra is that she an enigma."
A lot of people in this comment section already mentioned their interpretation which i share. It seems as if their relationship will take on the Bria-path. She says that Kira will "leave a mark" or imprint on his character. And precisely what is our favorite smuggler famous for? Cockiness, cynicism, distrust. It really looks like she'll end up betraying him.
Aldren(playing Han) on Qi'ra:
ReplyDelete"I think she has a slightly different way of handling herself in this tough universe. She’s better at working the system rather than bucking against it."
Okay *now* she sounds more than ever like a possible gray character. I'm getting a stronger implication that she'll really betray Han. The setup seems almost cliche and preditable: childhood friend, grew up together, there's a bit of romance between them, girl betrays guy, guy becomes bitter and distrustful. I'm not saying that the movie would be predictable, we can't really gauge that from a few minutes, but i think their relationship would be that type of cliche.
Also, that particular comment about Qi'ra being the last person Han kissed rattles me a bit. That is such a horrible thought. However, i'm not really bothered by it, because the guy isn't Harrison Ford. *that* picture will never be taken away from us.
I really, really hope that Qi'ra is not personally responsible for Han's chin scar. You know he will get it in this movie.
ReplyDeleteOh, ugh, I'd forgotten that....yeah, they have to explain EVERYTHING.
DeleteSo the StarWars twitter feed has adorable Han & Leia cookies because of course they're going to trade on Han/Leia while they gleefully trash them...I might have made a comment. It was probably lost among the Reylo noise because of course.
Sigh.
When I zoomed in on the scene of him and Qi'ra in the trailer, it looks like he already has it. Although you're right, they will probably show him getting it as a teenager (but I doubt Qi'Ra will give it to him unless it's an accident because they're not going to show Han's gf slashing a knife across his chin lol). Maybe it's just like how HF got it and he crashes his pod racer into a street pole!
DeleteThose replies on that twitter feed are horrifying. How are there so many Reyloers? Why is that ship so popular? I don't get it.
Oh, great. Just what I wanted to see. Apparently there are going to be a whole bunch of books and stuff coming out to tie in this new Solo story, and some Qi'ra stuff as well. There is even a book that spans the time frame before this movie, a little during-ish, and then some after ROTJ that apparently includes Leia and baby Ben. So, after they seemed to be holding back and bracing for disaster, now it appears that they are, in fact, going all in with it. I don't want to see a whole bunch of these books and all I can think when I see that is all the more opportunity for disaster. Yes, let's spend EVEN MORE time getting to know Han and Qi'ra in their teenage years and explore what will probably be a deep, unbreakable bond. Based on the amount of books I just saw, I think there will now be more new canon material of Han with other women than there is between Han and Leia. Yay! (yes, that was sarcasm)
ReplyDeleteI had heard a rumor that Qi’ra was getting two books so this isn’t as bad as I thought. I’m sure she’ll get another one about her years from 18-24 after the movie is released though. Since Emilia Clarke says they’re already a couple when Solo opens, my guess is the book will be about them falling in love and developing a romantic relationship as teenagers. The author writing it is known for romance YA novels.
DeleteIt’ll be just like the old Bantam novels where Han got more explicit innuendos and romantic love scenes with Bria than he ever got with his wife in Bantam (it got better when Del Rey took over). I was already annoyed Leia got more love scenes with Kier in her YA book than she’s gotten with Han in the new canon.
I’m surprised the Han/Lando book is coming out before the Solo movie and one of the parts take place between Solo and ANH. How are they going to explain Qi’ra being gone (we know she dies at the end of Solo almost guaranteed)? It’d be strange for Han not to think about her at all if she’s recently died and he’s nursing a broken heart.
Where's the stuff about the books? I've seen some covers. And ugh, after ROTJ? Great, are they going to further slander Han? There aren't enough words for how much I detest all of this.
DeleteIt was a link from Entertainment Weekly on Twitter. There was a LONG list of books stemming from this. Oddly, a lot of them are young adult, young readers, or outright children's books. They seem to mostly be skewing young on it, which is sort of weird to me. I mean, I get it, this is "young" Han Solo. But it's not like, middle school Han Solo here. He's just slightly younger and still involved in seedy stuff as far as I can tell.
DeleteAlready the Reylos are yammering about how they'll get to see young Ben Solo. Again, not enough words...
DeleteWhy would young readers want to read about Solo anyway? They only know old Han who's dead. The fans of Han who might drag themselves to this travesty are adults. It is weird.
The editor was promising we get something good with Han and Leia but y'know, I don't trust any of them as far as I could throw the Falcon, in whatever condition it's in.
I just have a general revulsion to anything in this film, similar to what I feel about seeing Kylo....
Here’s a description of the Han/Qi’ra book.
DeleteHan and Qi'ra don't have a lot in common other than not having a lot. They're street kids on the industrial planet Corellia, doing whatever it takes to get by, dreaming of something more. They each jump at a chance to prove themselves in the perilous world of Corellia's criminal underbelly, only to discover they are on the same mission for the same unscrupulous boss. When the job goes disastrously wrong, Han and Qi'ra are on the run--from pirates, a droid crime syndicate, the Empire, and their boss--and will have to learn to trust each other if they are going to survive.
The Han/Lando one sounds more interesting tbh.
I also think it's funny - the new "Last Shot" book with Han and Lando on the cover - but with their heads cut off so you can sort of squint and decide it's Billy Dee and Harrison. Plus the Falcon is in its "regular" configuration.
ReplyDeleteExcerpt from new "Last Shot" book here
ReplyDeletehttp://www.starwars.com/news/new-dad-han-solo-challenge-toddler-ben-last-shot-excerpt-exclusive
I want to like this, because cute, shirtless, just-woke-up Han asleep on the couch with his toddler. And then of course I remember that that toddler grows up to brutally murder him so nope, can't think this is cute.
DeleteDitto. I feel the same about the fantastic fan art that has been created in the wake of TFA. There are some truly great images of Han with his kid that would (in any other universe) delight my soul.
ReplyDeleteThis one, especially
This one, too.
And oh god the tragedy of this one
I really can't look at any of those pics and truly enjoy them, because I keep remembering THAT scene in TFA where it all ends. Imho, the final outcome for Disney!Han-and-Leia befouls every tender moment that may have come before it. Ruins it utterly for me, alas.
I'm with Erin and Zyra on this one - they want us to consume all this "cute little Ben" stuff - and then blame Luke, Han and Leia for him becoming a monster and isn't it all a tragedy - and they can cram it.
DeleteI got a few anon asks on Tumblr about how new fans went back and watched the OT and then saw TLJ and lost all their love for the ST - and more people piled on. There is open war on Star Wars Twitter after video came out about the LFL storygroup and someone had a picture of Luke and Vader from ROTJ on their desk with Luke X d out with a big red X. They tried to play it off that it was one person who was an Empire fan and now the defenders of the status quo are screaming about how fandom is harassing them when people rightly asked "uh, is this a pattern?"
Oh, and time travel is a thing now in Star Wars, did you know? But it's no big thing, unless you're a "hater"!
TPTB should look to their own house about people harassing other fans before they lecture anyone.
And the links I have seen about the TLJ novelization....get ready, it's going to get worse.
Well the third one at least I can pretend is any baby. It's not like her stomach has "Ben" scrawled across it, lol. I had seen one of those other ones but not the other. And yep, can't look at those and find it cute and I'm not sure how anyone else can either.
DeleteI saw that picture on Twitter. No idea what it means. But really, as much as I've never been a Luke fan anywhere near the same way I am with Han and Leia, I still want his character treated with some respect. And we all know based on the OT what he is willing to do for his friends and family, and the way he hopes and sees the best in people. It's just not the same guy at all. I will say that just last week I sat down and watched the OT blu rays for the first time in over a year. It's like a totally different universe from the ST. They aren't even remotely connected. It's not even something I have to convince my brain about, it's just not how it all turned out for them.
I heard some rumblings about how the novelization will make it worse. That will be interesting to see. This will be another book I don't buy or read though.
So today we got a few more details on the deleted scenes, including one of Luke and Leia in their separate places grieving Han. But it "interrupted the flow" or some nonsense.
DeleteI'm just going to look forward to seeing Mark, Harrison and George when Mark gets his star on March 8.
So is there a scene of them grieving Han? I haven't heard or seen anything about this.
DeleteYes Zyra, here's another person chiming in to say "HERE!" and please don't let this fade away into obscurity. It's really good to see new names as well as familiar ones here. This blog is a *site* for sore eyes (heh ;) ), and a welcome respite from places that don't quite share the same love for Han and Leia.
ReplyDeleteAnd yeah, Solo movie. Meh? We went with friends to see Black Panther, and arrived in the theatre to see the tail end of the Solo trailer. I started to get excited--it's a knee jerk reaction--Star Wars on the big screen! Yay!--but then my eyes caught up with the reaction... and... meh? The octopus thing looked cool, and maybe it will be a fun adventure, but meh? If I have a hankering for popcorn and soda and candy, I might sit down and watch that at the same time, but otherwise..
It just looks like a Fast and Furious film, which was not a franchise that ever appealed to me. Maybe Solo is supposed to be a film for folks who did like the franchise? Meh.
I saw the trailer with Black Panther too and I didn't see any enthusiasm for it in my theater. I thought it looked really flat - and wow, how much are they hiding Alden - he's barely in it and only in side shots for the most part.
DeleteSpeaking of Black Panther - there's how you make a villain and inter family conflict...
Did everyone see Mark's star ceremony with George and Harrison? I love that Mark asked for them to come and they both did - class all around. I hope Rian and Kathleen - who were there - noted how many people turned up and how crazy people online were to see Mark and Harrison together...
ReplyDeleteI watched it for the first time yesterday and I haven't been able to think much beyond the tremor in Harrison's voice when he mentioned missing Carrie... :( :( :(
DeleteIt would be nice if Kathleen & Co would somehow recognise that it's those characters and their relationships that are at the heart of the franchise and they should have been preserved as heroes; however, their continued support (and employment) of Rian says they just don't get it.
Did he ask them to come? If so I love even more that they were there. I only watched part of George's speech, then Harrison's and then Mark's. I guess though that is probably all I need to see. How does George still have jeans and sneakers from what looks like the early 90s? I just love how sincere and appreciative Mark is. So crazy he didn't already have a star even though I know that it isn't really about how big a star you are whether you have one or not. Some legends have been around forever and take 35+ years to get one (Harrison... but also Kermit the Frog) while others are famous for like 20 minutes and seem to get one.
DeleteAnyway, loved seeing them together, of course. Who would've thought Han and Luke would be dead when we were watching that? Oh wait, they aren't, because none of this counts.
-Z, while busy traveling the world but still making time to check in on youtube to watch star ceremonies.
There was another clip from, I think ET Canada, where he said that he was asked for a list of people he wanted there and they were on it and agreed to come - which surprised him because he said they both hate crowds and avoid press ::g::
DeleteI really think Carrie's death shook them all up - if they ever thought about it, I'm sure they all three thought Carrie would outlive them, certainly George and Harrison must have thought so.
It was so sweet to see them together and think what might have been. I hope James Gunn does put Mark in the 3rd Guardians. I still say someone should put the two of them in something together - I know if I had the power, I sure as hell would.
Aw, see that makes me happier that they were there, knowing he personally requested it. And it's probably one of those things where like, even if you don't really like the thing you're being asked to do, if it is for someone else you care about and you know it's important to them, you do it anyway. You know, like me being in my sister's wedding ;)
DeleteYou think they thought she would outlive them? I realize she was the youngest, but I've often thought that given her history, we're probably lucky we had her for even as long as we did. She could've just as easily died before she turned 30. In fact, maybe even more easily.
I forgot about the news of Mark in the 3rd Guardians, and yes, yes, YES to that! I hope that happens.
Yeah I wonder what they did think of Carrie, considering apparently John Belushi thought she was partying too hard... But I remember Mark at Celebration last year saying he was expecting to be doing that in 30 years for the Carrie rembrance panel and her mom lived into her 80s...
DeleteGeorge did make some comment about them getting to the end of the road.
The Star Wars website has a nice bit about the whole thing, go here, two minutes in:
http://www.starwars.com/video/we-talk-to-mark-hamill-harrison-ford-and-george-lucas-plus-bb-8-puppeteer-brian-herring
I forgot about the comment from Belushi. That's really saying something. Can't really compare her to Debbie though because Debbie didn't have the same sort of health issues.
DeleteAm I hearing that Rian is somehow just making things worse and worse about TLJ? I've been mostly disconnected for a couple of weeks.
True on Debbie...
DeleteOh, Lord, Rian won't shut his mouth and the DVD stuff released, so he gave some absurd comments about how he didn't want Luke to come off as a coward by going to Ach-To, so he decided that Luke thought if he removed himself from the fight, with no Jedi, the Sith wouldn't come back or some nonsense (Mark finally said the only way he could square it was Luke just saw that it was endless fighting with no end - which, that's nice, leave your sister and best friend to deal with it, because that works). Here's the link to the tweet with the clip:
https://twitter.com/starwars/status/974389780199899136
The other thing Johnson did is that he and Mark and Bergman the producer all took the documentary on how the movie came together (all 1 hr 45 minutes of it) to SXSW. During the audience questioning, someone asked Mark how he would have handled Luke in the movie and Johnson broke in with, "Yeah, how would you have done it, MF" and you can fill in MF with the expletive.
Fans went nuts.
Let's see....Mark dissed Reylo but was okay with SkySolo. Kelly Marie Tran apparently has a hidden Instagram account and said something semi positive about Reylo.
I think that's it. It's been a crazy three or so days.
Oh, I missed Bergman's best line! That Mark had to realize he wasn't Luke Skywalker any more, he was Obi Wan and something about Mark being demoralized by this. Which is so damn tone deaf that I really have stopped giving these idiots the benefit of the doubt any more. They set out to destroy the Lucas movies, that's all.
They sure did set out to destroy them. "Let the past die." Ok, fine, so why the hell did you not just set the movies further in the future when they were already dead?!?! Why did you make a point to kill it all with fire? It's just ridiculous! It isn't a requirement that Luke becomes Obi Wan. Or Yoda. Those two were in a different time.
DeleteIt's almost comical how frustrated Rian is getting dealing with all of the backlash. If your movie didn't suck, you would probably not feel the need to be so defensive.
Endless fighting with no end... well, that part seems about right. Seriously, what is the point of these movies? Rey's destiny is probably just to wind up with a horrible life anyway, so who cares?
About Mark's Hollywood Star ceremony... oh my goodness. So many feels. Yeah, George's comments, and Harrison's speech... I couldn't help thinking that they all realize that now that all three of them are officially out of Star Wars, their paths.... well... it might be tough for them to cross again...
DeleteAnd, during the photo-ops after the end of the ceremony... Billie Lourd and Kellie Marie Tran make it over to Hamill, and you can see them exchanging some words... there was something going on between Mark and Billie... hard to tell... but just... well. my speculations are merely that, but just so much love to them, those who were closest to Her Highness.
I just have to say that all this new Star Wars stuff makes me so sad. This should be the best time of our lives: new Star wars stuff coming up here and there... And by the time of PT we were thinking GEORGE raped our childhood! I would have NEVER EVER EVER believed it was DISNEY!
ReplyDeleteI forgot I wanted to comment on ONE bit of behind the scenes footage I actually liked. And that was when Mark heard Frank Oz as Yoda again saying "Young Skywalker" and you could tell even before he said anything that it totally hit him when he heard it. I just love that Mark is basically one of us and reacts how most of us would react. That is probably why it makes it that much more difficult to watch him have to pretend he likes all of this when we all know he feels exactly the same way we do about it!
ReplyDeleteI also found it funny that he joked about how Frank Oz hadn't aged a day while he had "aged tragically." That prompted me to look up how old Frank Oz is. I thought he was older, but nope, he's actually a couple of years younger than Harrison which really surprised me.
I saw Mark talking about walking around the Falcon on his last day filming on it and he looked like someone had shot his dog. I think Harrison said something too about thinking of all the good times they had had on that set. But yeah, Mark is a nerd and a fan of things and it's just been so hard to see him try to keep selling this nightmare. I really hope Luke doesn't come back for 9 unless they resurrect Han too because I think he's going to be really upset to be on that set alone - even if he was for most of ESB, Harrison and Carrie were in town for a lot of it.
DeleteEvery time I think I'm over it, I again am reminded that they brought them all back only to have their lives have been completely ruined and never actually see them all together again and I get angry again. It's just ridiculous.
DeleteAnother question I had, I was away when the novel came out and totally missed it, was there anything important in there? I doubt it, since I've seen nothing. It's almost weird to me how I've seen nothing.
And I just looked at Amazon to make sure it even came out and saw a book cover for some new Han book, with the stupid other guy on the cover, and I got mad again.
I read there was a lot of bad stuff about Luke (like that he tried to commit suicide several times on the island, and that Rey interrupted him just as he was about to try again, and that he wished he had just given the droids to the Empire and lived on Tatooine as a farmer married to Camie instead of running off to save the Princess - guess he would have been okay with his sister dying, then), but not a lot on Han and Leia. Kylo complains in it that Han and Leia would talk about him being closed doors like he was a monster not their son and that Leia shipped him off to Luke's to "get rid of him" because she was afraid of his power, but it's from his POV so I'm not sure we're supposed to take it as the absolute truth. A lot of Reylo content of Rey being attracted to Kylo and vice versa blah blah.
DeleteOh and Rian in the TLJ publicity rounds said Rey and Kylo touching hands is "the closest thing SW has ever done to a sex scene" - um, did he not watch ESB where Leia falls into Han's lap or they actually make out? I don't like Anakin/Padme but they actually had a scene of them in bed together with Anakin half naked. Even Jyn/Cassian in the elevator was way sexier than Rey and Kylo.
I have the book because I forgot to cancel the Amazon order. I probably won't read it but could look stuff up.
DeleteI thought the rule was that Star Wars movies had kissing when other movies would have sex scenes. I agree that it appears that Rian hasn't seen any previous Star Wars movies.
Suicidal Luke? Gee, and I thought we couldn't get much darker with this series now. Having Rey be attracted to the worst human in the galaxy is just about the worst thing they could do here. For real, let's think of a real world equivalent and see how we felt about a 19-year-old girl thinking he's hot with his shirt off even though she literally yesterday watched him murder his father. Disturbing.
DeleteI won't even entertain the thought of calling the hand holding thing a "sex scene." That guy is all kinds of messed up.
Even worse than that - it's a 19 year old girl thinking that a guy who (i) murdered his father and (ii) just shot up Parkland High is hot with his shirt off.
DeleteRian Johnson seems to me to have no guiding moral principles whatsoever.
I'd try telling them that, but then they'd just be like, "He's just misunderstood." Uh, ok. Cool that people don't have repercussions to their actions though.
DeleteGot to say something about the TLJ book, or, what I've read of it. (Admittedly very little though. I was flipping through it yesterday at a bookstore.)
DeleteThe segment opens with Luke having a dream about being married to Camie, etc. In the dream, he's now an older man, having lived out his days peacefully as a moisture farmer on Tatooine, having never gone off planet. And in this dream, he and Camie are talking about that day decades ago when he was outside Tosche station and saw a battle overhead, and that he turned out to be right about it involving a Star Destroyer. Camie says to Luke that she doesn't like the look he gets on his face when he thinks about that day in Tosche Station, a look that suggests he felt he had made a mistake living out his life peacefully with her, a look that suggests he wishes he would have run off and gotten involved with things off planet. Let me repeat that: a dream character, a manifestation of Luke's own mind, stated that Luke seemed to think it was a mistake to have stayed on Tatooine and that it was a mistake to have not run off to get involved with the Rebellion, etc.
Maybe I'm completely blind here, and maybe the rest of the book will crush what I'm about to say, but the symbolism of this opening dream is powerful to me, and I love it to pieces. One interpretation is for the character of Luke: subconsciously, Luke recognizes his attempts at living "peacefully" on Ach-To and refusing to "get involved" with the Resistance as a mistake. A second interpretation is also for Luke: subconsciously, Luke knows it would have been a mistake to stay on Tatooine all those years ago. A third interpretation is for us readers in the real world: ain't no way we should "forget about the past," because that past, those OT adventures, were absolutely the way thing should have been.
It's not just "he's misunderstood and hot" - which is scary enough.
DeleteIf you read some of the posts on Tumblr, they have invented this entire story of how "Ben" was abused/"groomed" by "child predator" Snoke who was in his head while Ben was "in the womb" and neglected/abused by Han and Leia and then by Luke - and they say "and that's what happened to me so I really relate." Plus he feels he's a monster - Han & Leia thought so and so does Rey! It was amazing that he stayed strong for 23 years and how could he do anything but what he did and Han died to save him and so did Luke and Leia would have and Rey probably will...
That's when it scares the daylights out of me. Also it disgusts me to see Star Wars reduced to this.
[Hope you enjoyed today's installment of "No! They will not take my OT away!! Thbbbpppttt"]
DeleteOk, so, the book then and that dream thing. Um, if Luke had never gone off to find Obi Wan and stuff, and just stayed on Tatooine... wouldn't he have simply been killed? I don't think making that decision would've meant he would just be left peacefully alone. He would've either been hunted down and killed, or he would've just been one of many, many random casualties of the Empire. Either way, no peaceful, happily ever after with Camie.
DeleteOh yeah, sure, again let's make it ok for someone to be awful just because they endured awful things. Yes, it is terrible of anyone endures awful things. But it DOES NOT mean that they do not deserve to suffer the consequences of their truly horrific actions.
Yeah, sorry, I knew I couldn't do it justice in my quick rehash. So the book's opening dream sequence dealt with all that you mention. Luke wasn't killed because... he caught up with the droids before they made it to Ben's, and returned them home. Stormtroopers eventually tracked down the droids and the Larses. Ben showed up and convinced the stormtroopers (a) to go easy on the Lars and (b) that Luke's last name was Lars, not Skywalker. Owen did get hauled off for questioning for a few days, and was eventually returned not quite himself, but, you know, you just don't talk about that sort of stuff. The droids' memories were wiped. Ben was never seen again. And, of course, sometime later the Darklighters disappeared too, which, you know, sometimes happens in this state of peace.
DeleteAnd yes, this "peace" was dealt with as well. It was explicitly said that the "peace" was really just "no conflict," which was (sorry, not an exact quote here) *about as close as you could get to actual 'peace'.*
So it's not at all the "peaceful, happily ever after" as we might think of in, say, an EU sense, or a "what we really wanted for H/L in the ST" sense. It's still a gritty grim dark vision. It's the "peace" that tempts us away from difficult action; it's the "peace" of what might have been if Luke had indeed kept his head down and not "gotten involved."
Thing is, even in this grimdark version, in the symbolism of the dream (the way I took the sequence), Luke knows full well, even if it's subconsciously, that to NOT have gone off to fight the Empire would have been a horrible mistake.
Which leaves me somewhat amused and satisfied, thinking that even though TPTB are trying to tear it all down... they just can't do it, not really. Not fully. Even their Jake Skywalker knows deep down that fighting the Empire --and now the First Order-- was and is the right thing to do. No matter how attractive the relative simplicity of "peace" might seem.
That is: I suspect that even TPTB may still be haunted by the ultimate goodness that is Luke Skywalker. HA! ;)
(I may or may not have been standing in the middle of the bookstore, jabbing my finger at the book while muttering fiercely "See!? Even you know that Luke was a hero and can be no other way!! Dumbasses!!")
As for your last paragraph, can you say more? Not quite catching your train of thought.
Got it. But yeah, there would still be conflict anyway. I know it's just a dream, but Luke doesn't go there and Leia dies, Rebellion probably still happens and fights for a while but then probably loses, Empire still does terrible things.
DeleteMy last paragraph, yeah, not worded well I guess. Just piling on when you mention the disturbing implications of people somehow relating to Kylo. And I'm saying that sure, it is awful when people have to endure awful things (even though Kylo in this case does NOT endure awful things, really) but if you endure awful things and then turn around and DO awful things, you no longer deserve any sympathy really. I still don't think I'm making much sense, so I'll probably drop this train of thought. Bottom line, Kylo is the worst and it is disturbing that anyone sympathizes with him, let alone RELATES to him!
Conflict anyways: yup. The Empire--and Jabba, he's still around too--certainly do terrible things. But if you stick your head in the sand (pun not intended, but boy did it work out well), you don't really notice, right? It's a very selfish "peace."
DeleteKylo: gah, yeah, cv73 pointed out some gross stuff on tumblr. It really is disturbing. (And I think you're making fine sense. I just confused by the pronouns in the absence of proper nouns. ;) )
"Kylo complains in it that Han and Leia would talk about him being closed doors like he was a monster not their son"
ReplyDeleteUh...good for Han and Leia for recognizing that he was a monster.
Yes. Someone posted me the author posting way back on Twitter about the books he'd read for the novelization and one of them was the Drama of the Difficult Child and another was a novel the person recognized as being about a monster child and the repercussions....
DeleteAlso, way to go, Kylo, for living up to Luke's fears for you!
Me, thinking about how off the rails this all is when someone writing a novelization of a Star Wars movie decides that a good book to read to prepare him to write that novelization is "The Drama of the Difficult Child":
Deletehttps://tenor.com/view/cary-elwes-robinhood-smile-gif-7513120
Turns out Qi’ra is the one who gave Han the dice you see in ANH and that he hangs up in TFA and Luke gives Leia in TLJ.
ReplyDeletehttps://twitter.com/yeahclarke/status/982697728953155584?s=21
Leia also thinks in the TLJ novelization that the dice are the only thing she notices Han keeps from his past life.
This makes the scene of Luke giving Leia the dice in TLJ really weird. “Hey sister, here’s the only thing your ex husband saved to remind you of him. They’re a gift from his ex girlfriend! He didn’t save anything from your marriage or family but he saved this gift from his ex girlfriend for over 40 years!”
Pardon me; I think I'm going to lose my breakfast. :(
DeleteSeriously, if that's really the case, I just hope it's the worst thing they do to H/L in Fauxlo. I am worried that he will confess his love for Qi'ra and she'll reply with, "I know", and thereby sully one of the most iconic scenes in the OT. That would be the final nail in the coffin as far as Disney is concerned.
I'm not keeping up with spoilers / teasers / trailers for this movie, though, so I'll try hard not to pre-judge it. I am really not interested in seeing it, though, which is a statement that would thoroughly shock and dismay 13-year-old me. I still remember my middle-school anguish after RotJ came out, realising that we had probably a couple of decades before George Lucas would make the sequel trilogy, and reckoning that we'd be "over thirty" by then. (I thought that was so old lolol)
I had heard this rumor swirling around but wasn't sure what it might have been based on. Wow, talk about twisting the knife that was already deep in the back of the whole Han and Leia romance.
DeleteI should be used to this by now. Really, since TFA came out they have continued to surprise me with how they can not only take my worst case scenario and bring it to reality, but they can also find new ways to make it worse that I couldn't even conceive of. I'm sure too that the further back story will only entrench the fact that now Luke giving Leia the dice is like, here, Leia, here's the thing from the woman who Han truly loved that wasn't you. I anxiously await when they later include Han cheating on Leia in a book somewhere. Maybe physical abuse? Nah, that's too overt, they seem to prefer these much subtler, but somehow more painful digs.
A cohort on Tumblr suggested Luke could have given Leia the Yavin medal & that would have been so much better.
DeleteThe dice was a throwaway sight gag in ANH, then the scene was cut out of TFA - and Han won the Falcon in a CARD game that requires skill in the old canon, not a lucky roll of the dice! Now these stupid dice come from an ex - it's ridiculous. I guess Kasdan wrote that scene into TFA because he was going to write them into his movie - he really is getting the last word on Lucas and Ford, isn't he? That leak that Q'ra was the one flying the Kessel Run was supposed to be debunked but I'm not so sure. If Kasdan can destroy everything about Han, I'm sure he will.
Almost anything would've been better, especially if they are ascribing sentimental value to this item that is all about SOMEONE ELSE ENTIRELY besides his wife who he spent 30 years with. Kessel run wasn't his, either? So, great, now they are going to turn him into a total liar too.
DeleteFrom other things I've read, they may very well also go overboard on Han being a real womanizer. However you felt about the old canon, Han did NOT come off as a womanizer. Based on the books he had a string of actual relationships. Those relationships weren't perfect, and neither was he, but it seemed to indicate he was at least (mostly) trying. But if they really in this new canon have him sleeping with so many women he isn't remembering names, I'm going to have a VERY hard time believing he would be all in with Leia, or that his past ways wouldn't be a problem. So all that is left is to make sure they let us know that he LIKED being a criminal and he CHOSE it not out of necessity, but because it is at the core of who he is.
The leak about Qi'ra doing the Kessel run I don't think is true. The same leak also said Beckett is her dad, which we've seen zero indication of in any promo material. The Han/Qi'ra book coming out says both of them are orphans and grew up together, so it doesn't make sense Beckett is her dad. It also says Han kills Qi'ra after she betrays him, which just seems way too dark for a SW movie, plus I doubt Disney would ever be brave enough to do an outright villain of someone who looks like Emilia Clarke.
DeleteThe main reason why the Qi'ra backstory of her giving Han the dice is strange now is that it totally changes that scene between Luke and Leia. It was supposed to be them remembering Han together, but now with this backstory it's going to be interpreted as Luke giving Leia a gift from Han's ex girlfriend, who Luke and Leia never knew, and that just seems really out of place. Same with Kylo who never met Qi'ra picking up the dice at the end of TLJ. Like Qi'ra's got no relationship to Luke, Leia or Ben/Kylo, but now her character is inserted in these two key scenes, one of which is the only scene we see (and will see) between Luke and Leia in TLJ.
Zyra, do you mean in the new canon comics and books? I don't think there's going to be anything about him being a womanizer in the Solo movie because from what it sounds like he's been in love with QI'ra since they were kids and until she dies at the end of the movie. There's no other women in the movie announced so I'm sure Qi'ra will be the only love interest we see for Han.
The trailer's up if anyone's curious: https://twitter.com/starwars/status/983143817829269504
DeleteI'm still not really interested in this film but Donald Glove is definitely killing it as Lando. And it's good to see Malla back with a costume upgrade from the Holiday Special lol.
I still get the feeling Qi'ra betrays Han, but then it doesn't really make sense if she does for him to hang the dice up in the Falcon in her memory. I guess it could work if she betrays him, but then sacrifices herself in redemption and Han forgives her so then hangs the dice up in the Falcon in memory of her.
Yes, I meant the books and stuff. Although just because there haven't been hints of it in trailers, doesn't mean that at some point they won't include it in the movie too.
DeleteUgh, stupid trailer. Does it say anything to anyone else how first, they waited a really long time to put out another trailer, and second, there was no warning about this? Unless I missed the warning, admittedly I haven't been paying attention. Plus, it still feels to me like they are trying to show as little of him actually speaking and acting as they can get away with.
Good call that it doesn't make sense for him to hang up the dice if she betrays him. You're right though, it will probably be horrible betrayal, but then she feels bad and makes some ultimate, tragic sacrifice so he will still probably hold a special place for her in his heart because she was the one he was meant to be with before he was forced to settle for Leia.
I doubt they'll be anything in the movie about him being a womanizer. Based on what's been leaked so far, he's head over heels for Qi'ra since they were kids over the six years this movie takes place until she dies at the end. So I doubt we will see him hooking up with someone else. I think we are supposed to think that after she dies and breaks his heart, then he reverts to being a womanizer to avoid any other woman getting close.
DeleteThe other thing about the dice not making any sense is that it's this big emotional scene when Kylo picks up the dice and then Rey slams the door in his face. But now it's just Kylo picks up the dice...from his dad's ex girlfriend whom he never met and has no relationship with? It really makes those two scenes of Luke/Leia and then Kylo handling the dice make no sense now.
They're really promoting her to be a a strong female heroine in all the promo material so I can't really see them having her doing anything too horrible, just maybe betraying him for totally understandable reasons but then redeeming herself by sacrificing herself (probably by jettisoning herself in the escape pod from the Falcon that is in Solo but is missing in ANH).
I'm kind of jealous of Qi'ra's outfits I have to say. That is one thing that looks kind of cool about the movie, all the glamour of the underworld.
I would like to say I doubt it too, but again, I'm just preparing myself for the worst.
DeleteYes, Qi'ra DOES get cool outfits. That we can agree on. And I suppose one minor nice side effect is getting to see different sorts of outfits in the GFFA. I don't know about anyone else, but I often struggle with what someone might wear in certain situations when writing fic. I mean, like most, I generally assume Han is always wearing the same exact clothes, lol. But it's nice to think of Leia as wearing different things, it's just hard to imagine what those different things might be without just putting her in clothes that might be considered to Earth-like.
Hey, to turn things and be happy for a change - I do the same re clothes. I wonder what the GFFA equivalent of things are. I did a short fic with Luke, Han and Leia after the war and part of it is them moving into their apartment and I'm wondering - what IS their work wear or leisure wear? Do they have jeans or workout pants? How do they stay fit? What about malls? What do they wear around the house? I mean, I have outfits to hang out in and outfits to clean in - do they have ratty shorts that can no longer be worn "out"? Slippers? Does Leia have around the house bras?
DeleteI'm working on what I like to call House Hunters Intergalactic and I was going to make it like what I went through buying a new house - picking out countertops and tile and all - I guess it's the same? These are the things I wonder...
You're right, just reading that and thinking about it totally changed my mood, lol. I think it's a fascinating question, really. I have exactly one story where I had Han wear formal attire, and in my head for some reason I can actually clearly picture it. And I didn't think about it really until just now, but I think my idea of his outfit might kinda come from that silly Glove of Darth Vader series where at the end of that there is another version of Han and Leia's wedding. But basically it was just like, regular dress pants, boots (because it seems like nobody has regular shoes, everyone always has boots at all times) a white shirt like he usually has, but buttoned up, and then an open short jacket. Which I guess is similar to the blue jacket, but more fitted. I just assume that there are no ties for men in the GFFA because it's such an odd concept anyway. Leia's dresses I always tend to think of more like regular Earth dresses. Which is probably wrong, but, well, easier.
DeleteLounge wear, I get sloppier about it. I think tshirts should be a thing they have, because I can see Leia wearing Han's. And how often have we all referenced Han's supposed lounge pants? I think they have those too, and I think Leia has her own. Probably no jeans though. No idea on workout clothes. What is an around the house bra? The beauty of "around the house" is the bra goes in the drawer where it belongs ;)
Shoes I feel like are the hardest. Because like I said, they seem to almost exclusively wear boots. Leia does get some simpler shoes though like with her Bespin dress. You ever notice too though how even though Leia wears a few outfits that at first glance look like a dress, there are actually pants involved? That's kind of interesting too.
I think the simplest solution to this problem is to more often than not, simply write them naked, lol.
Heh. I've been working on all these fluffy domestic stories for them and I have been trying to think of these things (unfortunately some of us are cursed with needing around the house bras on occasion...)
DeleteWhat do they do on the weekends (or are they like the Dowager Countess and there are no weekends)? Those are the things I think about when I'm in line at the grocery store pondering, or waiting for takeout or whatever I'm up to in mundane world.
Yeah no one seems to wear just shoes!
I think Leia is probably in a position where she can get away without an around the house bra... at least pre-kids. And not that after kids things would've changed there, it's probably just less ok to let the girls roam free with your kids around, lol.
DeleteAnd hey, I hear you on things like what they do on weekends. As I recently went and collected a bunch of my random one-shots from here, I realized I have a LOT of stories of them like, mostly sitting around at home doing nothing. I tend to picture Han in pajama pants and t-shirts, and Leia in like, maybe a robe and some pajama pants and slippers. So Basically I don't have ideas. I just always picture them sitting around and doing nothing but being all cute and stuff.
Okay, I've tried to stay calm about this but thinking about it more and more over the past few days I just can't! I can come to no other conclusion that they are trying to retroactively now say Qi'ra was the love of Han's life, not Leia's, and that Disney is actively trying to destroy Han/Leia. I was trying to give them the benefit of the doubt before but I can't see this any other way!
DeleteThink about it: With this new backstory that Qi'ra gave the dice to Han, he hung onto them for over 40 years after their relationship ended. OVER FORTY YEARS. Not only that, they were his most treasured possession and Leia thinks in the TLJ novelization that they are the ONLY personal item he has in his entire ship. People keep stuff from their exes all the time, sure, but they don't PUT THEIR GIFT UP IN THE MOST PROMINENT PART OF THEIR BELOVED HOME FOR DECADES (the Falcon is Han's home), including during their eventual marriage to another woman. THEN after he loses the Falcon, he carries this gift from her in his pocket for over what? A decade? When he gets the Falcon back, the first thing he does is pull the dice out of his pocket (so he's been carrying them with him all this time, including when he's been separated from Leia), kiss them, hang them up and then give a huge smile (despite the fact that he is now separated from his wife and his son is killing people). This new backstory means that he is thinking of Qi'ra during this moment. There's no other rational explanation. We are not shown that he kept ANYTHING from his relationship with Leia over their decades of marriage, and we are never shown a scene of him looking at anything about him and Leia's relationship sadly like we are with him now looking at the dice in TFA.
Then the cherry on top of the rancid sundae, LUKE gives LEIA in their only and last scene in the ST when they're remembering Han....A GIFT FROM HER HUSBAND'S EX GIRLFRIEND. Not anything he kept from them and their marriage, but a token of his ex's affection that he carried around for over 40 years, long after his marriage to Leia broke down. And Leia is supposed to just be happy with this token, happily accepting that she was her husband's second choice and that he loved someone else their entire marriage and never got over her, and Leia could never fill that void in his heart.
This is the WORST kind of retroactive explanation they could give for the dice scene in ANH and the later ones in TFA and TLJ. I don't mind some prequel explanation, but this is just awful and craps all over Han/Leia. What's next, a scene where Han says "I love you" and Qi'ra says "I know"?
It's just unspeakably awful. Who thought this was a good idea?
We won't know for sure what the dice signify to Han until after the movie is out, I guess, but (for me) the more they crap all over Han/Leia, the easier it is for me to reject it all wholesale.
DeleteWhat I mean is, if they were being moderate and reasonable in their treatment of these characters, I might feel a bit of (internal) pressure to accept the official canon as a plausible future for H/L/L/C. But their meddling is so cack-handed and outrageous, it has become laughable. Granted, it's pained laughter, because I had hoped for so much better. But I don't feel there's anything at all plausible about the way they've depicted Luke, Leia, Han or Chewie (when they've bothered to give Chewie a character moment at all). It's ridiculously, stupidly wrong, and that makes it easier for me to dismiss it.
As Kels pointed out, it doesn't even make sense on multiple levels. First, of course there was nothing else of Han's on the ship. He hadn't had it in... how many years? We don't even know. 2? 5? 15? No idea. Then he had it back for one ride to Maz's, and one ride back to wherever the Resistance was, and then he was dead. The only possessions of his he could've left there would be whatever he had in his pockets. He didn't have time to pack up whatever he had when he left that ship with Rey and Finn.
DeleteBut, again, like Kels said, they are suddenly now trying to ascribe all this meaning to something that before this moment has had no back story, and that 99% of fans have never even noticed was a thing. I had heard of these dice mentioned in the past, long before the ST, but until I think my most recent viewing of ANH, I never noticed them. And in fact until TLJ I had assumed that they looked entirely different. You know, like Earth dice or something. I've seen that movie like a hundred times and I never noticed.
And again, there you are describing this scene and Han putting the dice back and... THAT WASN'T EVEN IN THE MOVIE. Seriously, anyone who has watched ALL of the movies and doesn't go around reading source material, which is MOST fans, sees these dice in TLJ and it's like... where did those come from? Because also, they weren't even there in ESB and ROTJ. It's very, very weird to suddenly put all this meaning behind something that most people never even noticed. Especially when apparently some of its meaning was left on the cutting room floor in the last movie. That said, I do totally agree that they seem to be going out of their way to make sure that they find anything they possibly can to undermine Han and Leia. It's just weird, if you think about it, how badly they want to destroy it.
Like Erin though, because it is SO off the rails and seemingly deliberate, not to mention it makes hardly any sense, it makes it a whole lot easier to dismiss it all. If they gave us bits and pieces of nicer stuff I'd be more inclined to maybe want to believe at least some of it. But this? Nah, this is all so insane and beyond wrong that I can much more easily convince myself it is meaningless and I don't have to follow it or give it a second thought.
Lastly yes, I said it before, I'll say it again: I completely expect that Han will tell this other woman he loves her and she will reply "I know." I've thought that since they announced this movie. They have been finding much more creative ways to ruin Han and Leia, it's only fitting that they would at least go with the easiest and most obvious.
Oh you’re right it was a cut scene! https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=FF20B6clkn4 I remember seeing a scene of Han kiss the dice and hang them up but I didnt realize it’s actually not in the movie and was cut. I googled about it and Rian wrote TLJ based on the original cut of TFA not the final copy so that explains why the dice are given such importance.
DeleteThere is just no other way to interpret Han hanging onto dice his past love gave him for over 40 years as anything other than him holding onto her memory and hanging the dice up in her honour. Trinkets from past loves have always served as important symbols in cinema and the filmmakers know that. I saw someone on Tumblr say having Qi’ra give Han the dice is their lazy way of making up for the fact that Han never mentions her the entire OT and ST to now retroactively show that she was so important to Han that he carried a memory of her around his entire life until he died.
Even the media thinks this new backstory undermines Han’s later relationship with Leia! http://epicstream.com/news/Solo-A-Star-Wars-Story-Are-Hans-Lucky-Dice-Actually-QiRas
I'm pretty sure that people who see this garbage (which will not include me) will be subjected to I love you/I know from short, receding-hairline, low-T version of Non Solo and the brown-haired Mother of Dragons British accented Kathleen Kennedy Mary Sue (as all Star Wars females are now) as well, because if one thing is absolutely clear, it's that Kasdan is trying to reclaim Han Solo as his. Problem: TFA made it pretty clear, and this film may make it more clear, that the actual workable arc of Han Solo is due to Kershner, Ford, and Lucas, while Kasdan was just the scrivener who had a way with dialogue on the films (although history shows that Ford, Fisher, and Kershner even did a lot of dialogue work).
DeleteWhile Kasdan didn't want that line -- as anyone who has ever read anything about SW knows, it's Harrison Ford's line, and it's also Han's most iconic line -- I have little doubt that Kasdan will try to use it now in order to diminish it's importance in TESB, diminish what Ford/Fisher/Kershner/Lucas did, diminish the Han/Leia relationship, and to have the last say, in the same way he used TFA to get the last say on what he thought of Han/Leia's relationship and Han's ultimate character. If TFA wasn't what it was regarding Han and Leia, I wouldn't be thinking so negatively about what Kasdan is doing, but his hack job on those characters in TFA was really disgraceful, IMHO, given that he would be nothing without Lucas handing him ESB.
I really, really, really hope I am wrong about this, but as Zyra has said over and over, every time we think we're wrong and they could't do anything more horrible, they pull something unthinkably awful out of their arse, so why would they not do this?
I hope Ron Howard has the wisdom to leave it on the cutting room floor if it was shot, because my guess would be Howard wouldn't like it, but I am not sure he has that power with Kathleen Kennedy hovering over the editing bay.
And the dice? Y'all, they're MERCH. They only reason these callow studio yes-monkeys are making any noise about the dice, which were just an in-joke about American Graffiti in Star Wars and had NOTHING to do with the Star Wars universe, is so they can sell them at every Disney park ever. Dice key chains, dice earrings, dice necklaces, dice toilet paper, you name it.
Which still doesn't answer the damn preliminary question that comes even before the issue of "why would Luke give Leia the dice that Han's old girlfriend gave him?" (If that's even true, like everybody's said, we don't know yet - although if recent history holds, not only will she give him the dice, she'll give him the dice as he says "you'll always be the love of my life-I love you!" and right before she dies while saying "I know," because it is ALWAYS worse than you can imagine at this point).
The preliminary question is: HOW WAS A PROJECTION/HOLO CARRYING AROUND A SOLID OBJECT AND HANDING IT TO SOMEONE IN THE FIRST PLACE??? THAT IS NOT A THING.
Qi’ra gives Han the dice. They released a promo pic on Sunday of her holding the dice. She’s in her teenage outfit in the promo pic so it looks like she gives them to him when they’re together as kids. You can also see the dice dangling from Han’s speeder in the trailer when him and Qi’ra are in it.
DeleteI'm not surprised. But all I'm going to know about this movie is what I hear on this site and anywhere else people who want to see Disney Star Wars die a rapid and ignominious death gather.
DeleteI really do think we all need to stop calling them "the dice" and calling them "the merch," because there's no other reason for a tchotchke to get so much play. It's all a big merch ploy. Hopefully, this movie will flop so hard it looks like a kid on ice skates for the first time and merch is irrelevant, but the dice are only a thing because they are a new item that can be sold.
I get a real kick out of the whole "Han never talks about her in the movie" thing. Uh... so? Leia never talks about her freaking parents (ok briefly Luke asks her about her mother, but whatever, ONE time), or ANYONE she ever knew from her past. Luke never mentions his aunt and uncle. Where, exactly, and WHY would Han have brought up a childhood friend/girlfriend? That is the dumbest thing I've ever heard. Not to mention, IF for some reason I find myself with a husband at some point in my life, I can't imagine I'd be cool with finding out my husband was keeping something to remember an old girlfriend. That is downright disrespectful.
DeleteOh, as for the projection, supposedly he didn't REALLY give her the dice, it was just a Force projection of them, and that is when Leia "knew" that he wasn't really there. But I don't know how that will work going forward. Chances are the stupid dice will be in 9 too, and perhaps they will hold the key to everything as they uncover Han's past and his real true love or something.
It’s normal to keep stuff from past relationships and I wouldn’t care if my husband had stuff from an ex (in fact I know he still keeps gifts and such if he likes them). But it’s an entirely different matter for a guy to hang a gift from his ex in the most important part of his home (the Falcon is Han’s home) for decades after the relationship ends which includes a marriage to another person, and then carry them around in his pocket for over a decade while he’s still married to someone else even if you later separate from them, then have the first thing he does when he gets his home back is to put the gift from his ex up, and THEN have his brother in law and widow choose the gift from his ex as the object to remember him by. When we see no evidence that Han kept any object to remind him of Leia and their life together even after they separated.
Delete*solid*
DeleteYeah, I don't even know if the dice not really being there is a fan theory or if it is described in the book or what. Either way, stupid.
DeleteOk, fine, that was too generic a statement about keeping things from old girlfriends. I guess if it was something USEFUL, or like, a cool jacket or something, fine. But again, we are talking about a specific object that serves no actual purpose that he kept in a place where he would be looking at it ALL THE TIME. So more of an apples to apples comparison here, if your husband had an ex girlfriend who gave him some little trinket like that, would you think it was odd that he hung it off the mirror in his car to look at all the time? Especially when this fake version of Han they have presented us with doesn't seem like a sentimental sort of guy, who clearly has nothing about Leia he holds dearly. But like you said, to then later use it as a symbol of Luke giving it to Leia is just... odd to say the least, especially if given this sort of back story.
Yes, agreed. And the Falcon is more than a car, it's Han's beloved home. So it's even more insulting to Leia to hang his ex's gift from the cockpit all this time. Does Leia even know they're from Qi'ra? The TLJ novelization has Leia think that they're Han's most treasured possession, but nothing that she knows they come from his past love. Otherwise, Leia's reaction when Luke gives them to her is strange. While I don't see Leia as a jealous/insecure person and I'm sure she gets that Han has a past before her, it seems OOC for her to develop an attachment to a gift from Han's love before her. The whole thing is very strange decision making story wise. I've even seen a lot of non Han/Leia fans on twitter say that having Luke give Leia a gift from Han's previous girlfriend is a terrible decision story telling wise, so it's not just us who are outraged!
DeleteOn Han not talking about Qi'ra during the OT and ST - No one would expect him to (he didn't talk about Bria either!) but if Kasdan's goal now as I think it may be to retroactively change the Han/Leia love story that Qi'ra was really the love of Han's life and the reason Han's relationship with Leia failed was because she was just a replacement for Qi'ra that never matched up, having the dice be a memory of hers is an easy way to show that Han never got over her, because we know from the ST (Kasdan wrote TFA which has that scene of Han hanging up the dice) Han carried the dice around for over 40 years after Qi'ra gave them to him. I'm sure the new canon (books, comics, etc.) too will also have Han frequently thinking of Qi'ra and how much he wishes he could have been with her instead of Leia!
Y'know, in the story I wrote in this beknighted canon, I had Han have his few momentos on Kashyyk and he carried around a picture of the three of them from back in the day in his inner jacket pocket. I could see him having a holo of he and Leia or the medal (love that idea) - but those stupid dice? I would think that's Abrams' idea, but y'know, it's Kasdan's. He wrote the new movie, he co wrote TFA, he probably put it in there as a stealth maneuver, didn't tell even Abrams why, just that it was a cool call back, Johnson picked it up from the script, and Ford, Fisher & Hamill didn't know why. I wonder if someone's going to ask Mark - just yesterday he said he really has no feeling about coming back for 9 because everyone's gone:
Deletehttp://comicbook.com/starwars/amp/2018/04/10/star-wars-mark-hamill-episode-ix-carrie-fisher/
Zyra wrote: "So all that is left is to make sure they let us know that he LIKED being a criminal and he CHOSE it not out of necessity, but because it is at the core of who he is."
ReplyDeleteAll the better to explain how he goes from general back to smuggler. That's not who Han is. Kasdan has had it in for Han and I read all these folks on my Twitter feed going on about "oh, Kasdan's wrote him more than anyone!" Right - the fanboys hate him in Jedi and blame Ford, not what Kasdan wrote. Blame him for Han dying when it was Kasdan and Abrams. He's going to be just a guy who was always going to be a smuggler, no drive, no nothing. He lucked into everything, they'll probably devalue him as a pilot even further, and set him up as an idiot. Even if Q'ra doesn't make the Kessel Run, she'll probably be a better pilot or shot or teach him something and I just can't. Even Chewie is short.
The last trailer or whatever dropped tonight and I just...this is going to be a long two months of endless articles and ads and I don't even want to think. All I can hear in my head is Leia saying "why are they doing this?"
I hope this thing is a flop with awful reviews but I'm sure Disney has paid off the right folks.
Yep, exactly. They are hell-bent on making sure that Han, ultimately, really is a truly bad guy who lucked into some stuff temporarily, but in the end, got what he deserved by being murdered by his own son after spending his final few years alone and doing a terrible job of smuggling and swindling people out of their money. What a stupid character.
DeleteWell now I'll be right there with you hearing Leia saying that in my head. I literally cringed when I clicked on the trailer. This after I just went to see Ready Player One, and in spite of the 37 trailers they played before it, I was beyond relieved that Solo was NOT one of them. It didn't really make me feel WORSE about this, I guess. But we already know how low my expectations were.
I can't even watch. Already the shills are cranking up in my Twitter feed with how awesome it's going to be. Even people screaming about Last Jedi are going to it. Just today on Tumblr, several of us were setting people straight AGAIN about how Han is destroyed in TFA as badly as Luke in TLJ. Sigh...
DeleteI saw the original trailer before Black Panther and it looked like garbage on screen. Why is the cockpit so damn dark? Doesn't anyone know how to light a film any more?
Get ready, we're about to drown in articles about how hard Ehrenreich worked and what Ford told him and how he's the Han we need now, enlightened and not misogynistic or whatever crap Disney wants to push. Y'know, he can have a strong heroine stand by him - just wait.
If I didn't know better, I'd probably be excited about it too. You know what I like? Chewie. Yes, Chewie looks great. And Lando looks decent too. They show a lot of Lando in the trailer, which is odd considering I've heard he's not really in that much of the movie.
DeleteIt's dark because it's "different" probably. I don't know. They will do dumb things you haven't thought of them trying to do.
Yep, the last thing I want is anything other than Harrison Ford's face pertaining to anything Han Solo related. It is going to get very annoying in future comics, which could have easily de-aged Harrison but now will show this idiot's face. I just so, so, SO hope this movie fails bigtime. Unfortunately, now that it is getting closer, I don't think it will. Like I don't think it will be GOOD, but I think it will probably do well enough that they can all convince themselves that it went well and was a success. And oh you're right, they will probably try and bring up how Han was awful in the OT. So many bad things about all of this.
As all of you have pointed out above, NONE of this makes any logical or coherent sense, which is funny, because for a while I thought that if you wanted to try to absolutely destroy what Lucas created in the OT, you could not have made a better attempt than Kennedy, Abrams, Kasdan, and Johnson, and now I think they are so laughably incompetent that they can't even destroy what Lucas created in a way that makes sense. Unfortunately, a lot of people have become so incapable of analyzing story, they'll just pretend that this works, because it requires no critical faculties.
ReplyDeleteIn the end, though, when you're just a pack of vultures snuffling around the corpse of the great lion, no matter how smug and self-satisfied you are while tearing it to pieces, you're still just a carrion bird, and you'll be forgotten while the lion will be remembered. I hope Abrams, Kennedy, Kasdan, and Johnson ponder how well remembered and regarded the folks who wrote and produced "Scarlett" and "Rhett Butler's People" are 25 years down the line before they go to sleep at night.
this!
DeleteReminder to self (and to anyone else feeling deeply dismayed by all of these rumours): Han and Leia (and Luke and Chewie) lived happily ever after, as heroes of the war against the Empire, and legends in their own time. The End.
ReplyDeleteMy strategy to help me cling to this version of events is to avoid as much as possible speaking about SW to anyone who thinks otherwise! lol I know there will be plenty of Han/Qi'ra fans out there after Solo is released, and they're certainly entitled to 'ship whomever they wish, but I don't want to read their comments (or fics) or see any imagery, etc. (Huh. I guess one good thing about the recasting of the role is that images of "Han Solo" with his erstwhile girlfriend won't be images of Harrison-Ford-as-Han-Solo with another woman. So, yay?)
In the absence of the power to knock some heads together at LFL/Disney and make them fix it all, all I can do is ignore it. And write fic in defiance.
You are so right. One good thing is that every time I hear some new crap I feel the urge to read or even write a scene that shows Han and Leia how most of us here see them. Luke got to be happy too, just so we have that squared away.
DeleteYes, indeed. Keep writing - that's all we can do. I eventually will make the Tumblr post on this, but if you listen to satellite radio, on the 60s channel, they have old DJ Cousin Brucie and he does an oldies show on weekends. The ad for his show is him saying this to all his listeners/cousins: "We have a big job to do. We have to keep the music we love alive."
DeleteThat's how I view bashing around on Tumblr and Twitter and writing positive fic.
Can I just say how much I like ""We have a big job to do. We have to keep the characters we love alive" as a slogan for Han/Leia fans?
DeleteSeconded. I sometimes find it difficult to summon the will to keep writing, considering how a big chunk of the active fandom (and most casual viewers) now accept the current canon. It's depressing.
DeleteBut that is precisely when it's most important to keep writing (as Mara Sheridan said a while ago, "Fight back with fic"), and I am glad to be reminded of that. If we don't keep the OT heroes (as we know and love them) alive, nobody will, which means they'll disappear completely, superseded by the Disney version. And that's just tragic.
It's been a while since I worried about this specific issue, that it could be possible that this new stuff would do so much damage to Han and Leia, and that so many people would accept it, that there wouldn't really be any room left for happy stories about them. Currently, I do believe there is a strong enough core group of authors who are writing great stories that support the happier version of Han and Leia. I just hope that trend continues, because it definitely IS somewhat scary. I mean for those of us who write the EU kids it's hard not to notice a drop in readers who aren't interested in reading about stories that include those kids. I can't really be upset about that because people have just as much a right to not be interested in reading about that as I do about not wanting to read about Ben Solo. It can certainly be disheartening, though!
DeleteDifference: There is no such thing as Ben Solo.
DeleteThanks Kels & Erin - I think that's a great slogan too!
DeleteThere are fans out there excited to read OT stuff and I keep going for them. And out of spite for new canon ;-)
It sounds like Han and Qi’ra are going to have quite a few love scenes and a scene at least implying they’re going to have sex: https://www.gamesradar.com/the-writers-of-solo-a-star-wars-story-discuss-the-films-tone-were-not-dealing-with-the-spiritual-side/
ReplyDeleteYou have to hand it to Larry Kasdan - he played the perfect long game. He waited long enough to get the ending he wanted for Return of the Jedi - Leia alone, Han dead, Luke walking off like Shane. Now he gets to finiish off Han and Leia not only at the end but at the beginning too. He must really really hate Lucas and Ford underneath it all because no on remembers Body Heat or The Big Chill or Silverado, they remember Empire and Raiders.
DeleteI like Ron Howard but I hope that movie takes a nosedive.
I think the movie will do fine financially (the trailers make it look pretty decent) but I kind of doubt Han/Qi'ra will be iconic the way Han and Leia still are 40 years from now, even though Kasdan clearly wants to make them the new IT couple. I already saw a magazine cover that said Han and Leia should move over, Han and Qi'ra are the new IT couple. They said the same about Anakin/Padme, and that didn't turn out so well.
DeleteLike for example, I was thinking of going as Qi'ra to Comic Con (don't kill me guys, I just think her outfits are super cool) but then I was like would anyone even know who I was? While with Leia everyone would instantly recognize who I was playing because she's so iconic.
Of course in the meantime her fans will probably be annoying for a few years. I had one tweet at me the other day saying "Han and Leia didn't last either, so who's to say Leia's the love of his life", uh at least they lasted 23 years in canon while your ship only lasted 10 and they were separated for 6 of them? I don't get shipping something where you know the guy ends up canonically moving on and marrying someone else, but shippers are weird. Also the movie isn't out yet, you have no idea what their relationship will bel like!
Jonatan Kasdan seems to have forgotten the movie HIS OWN DAD WROTE like "This is the first time we see Han truly attracted to a woman and enter a romantic and sexual relationship"? Uh, what the hell was the entire movie of ESB about? I'm not surprised they're going to have more explicit sexual scenes between Han an Qi'ra though because 1) it's 2018 compared to 1980, if ESB was made today, we'd also probably see a scene of Han and Leia going to bed together on Cloud City 2) they only have one movie to build up an epic romance, Han and Leia had 3 (now 4). But if this is THE most romantic Star Wars yet, that means the love scenes will take up more than like 50% of the movie? Because AOTC was the most romantic Star Wars to date and the love scenes were like half that movie! Yet the promos don't really seem to be focusing on the romance aspect.
Well, I just hope she stabs him in the back before she inevitably dies, and that she doesn't die like sacrificing herself to save Han and Chewie to redeem herself.
Honestly, at this point, I can't even take any articles seriously. Probably 80% of the time these days things are just to garner clicks to get people to read, even if it doesn't have any real substance. Who knows what these people really did with this movie. We should find out in just over 2 weeks when it comes out at Cannes and hopefully some people spoil it for us so we can be completely prepared for how bad it is for Han and Leia. I have completely lost faith that any of these people have any idea what they are doing in terms of character and story. So I don't even care what they have to say anymore.
DeleteI know what you mean about click bait, but Games Radar is actually a legitimate site and that article actually includes interviews with Kasdan so that article at least is based on something, not like the click bait articles about how Lando is bi because he called Han baby in the trailer (not that I wouldn’t mind Lando being bi!)
DeleteThe premiere is actually May 10 so we’ll get spoilers around then.
Kasdan made it sound like romance was going to be an even bigger part of Solo than it was in AOTC and I’m still not getting that from the promos. Another BTS featurette drooped today and it had a brief clip of Han and Qi’ra about to kiss but the rest was all action, action, action. Which audience are they trying to cater to here? AOTC promos were all about the love story.
Oh and Kasdan said in that BTS feature Han is his favorite character. He has a funny way of showing it from how he was treated in TFA. Then again Rian said Luke was his favorite character.
Oh, not saying it isn't a legitimate site. More like, the way these guys talk, they seem to make a much bigger deal out of a lot of the things they are doing than most of us are seeing on screen. I mean, some of these guys are telling us that Rey and Kylo holding hands is basically a sex scene. Um... except that most of your audience didn't see it that way... AT ALL. So they can say this stuff as much as they want but I'm not sure I'll buy it entirely until I see it.
DeleteI mean, all that said, of course I still fully expect that there will be at least a dozen moments between Han and Qi'ra I'll wish we could've seen for Han and Leia.
I know what you mean. Rian Johnson is out to lunch with that. I don't think we'll see like an R rated scene of them having sex or anything, but from what they said probably a scene of them going to bed together or waking up in bed next to each other the next morning or something is as far as it will probably go.
DeleteI gotta say "a young Han movie as an opportunity to really deal with a romantic and sexual relationship where he’s truly attracted to a woman and it’s a big part of the dynamic"
... really irked me.
Like, no, we didn't get sex scenes in the OT, but come on - the HanLeia dynamic is one of the most iconic, sexiest things in the history of cinema. Perhaps I'm reading that quote wrong, but "he’s truly attracted to a woman and it’s a big part of the dynamic" surely is Han and Leia in the OT? What am I missing here?
It reads like he wasn't REALLY attracted to Leia but since she was the only woman around he took her.
I just read it as ego and overthinking their own self importance here. "Oh, we're doing something that hasn't been done!" Except yes, it has. And I'm sure way better than you're doing here. Just like with Rian and the "closest to a sex scene." No, not true. They're tooting their own horns here and it doesn't make sense. If other people decide to say hey, this is the first time we've gone there with these movies! I don't trust anything these people are saying about themselves.
Delete